Drinking age lowered to 18?

[Tokzic]

Re: Drinking age lowered to 18?

I disagree heavily with Shash concerning driving age being raised to 21. There's a very large difference between drinking and driving: In drinking, there's a very minimal learning curve, and a very large maturity level, while in driving, it's the opposite way around. Being an adequate driver has barely anything to do with maturity. Not to say that it doesn't factor in at all - you can't be blaring the horn and doing doughnuts in the middle of the road - but an immature driver beats an untrained driver.

Not sure how it works in the States, but in Canada, you need 8-12 months of training starting at 16 - so you're really closer to 17 before you can drive alone. Works fine up here.

[Callipygian]

Re: Drinking age lowered to 18?

Yet a strong parallel can be drawn to the modern "war on drugs", and despite the actual failure of this practice, people stand behind it regardless.

All it'd take is a group of stupid sheep to bring back prohibition, and I think the time is ripe for that type of populous to do this sort of thing. All it needs is the right spark.

And to interject a point: mature alcohol consumption is best learned through experience. This experience is easily achieved by direction from parents. This is most easily achieved before young adults strike out on their own. Let them strike out at 18, but not drink til 21, and that's when people fail to control themselves. They need to learn responsibility for this just like all things, and doing it on their own is a shortcut to failure.

If it were up to me, I'd say something along the lines of a permit system for alcohol purchase/consumption between 18 and 21. Maybe work it on a parental permission system. At the very least, all parents should be allowed (and encouraged) to actively teach their "children" to drink responsibly before they leave the nest.

As I commented earlier, prohibition of all ´soft vices´ like alcohol, soft drugs and prostitution, would seem morally justified, but has perverse effects and adverse externalities. Certainly with alcohol, a commonly available and accepted ´socializer´, people should be aware of its effects and have learned through experience before they are on their own.

From my own experience as an international student in Berkeley, I can say the European students, most of whom can tell you embarassing stories of coming home drunk at age 16 and never crossing that border again, acted more responsibly at parties than their American counterparts. Many undergrads who turned 21 would be sucked into excessive partying and inebriation, making fools out of themselves and sometimes getting seriously sick.

While I agree that public education is generally quite bad in the US, this doesn´t mean, as has been suggested in this thread, that we should give up on education or informing citizens altogether.

[Magewout]

Re: Drinking age lowered to 18?

What I don't really understand is why your government allows kids to drive, and potentially kill lots of other people, at the age of 16, when drinking only harms the person who does it, and they've got to be 21.

Over here, the drinking age is 16 and the driving age is 18, and it works very well IMO. You learn how to deal with alcohol before you're allowed to drive.

Btw I can confirm Callipygian's story about coming home drunk at 16 and never wanting to do it again, most of my friends (and myself) have experienced that.

[Nullifidian]

Re: Drinking age lowered to 18?

From my own experience as an international student in Berkeley, I can say the European students, most of whom can tell you embarassing stories of coming home drunk at age 16 and never crossing that border again, acted more responsibly at parties than their American counterparts. Many undergrads who turned 21 would be sucked into excessive partying and inebriation, making fools out of themselves and sometimes getting seriously sick.

I kinda thought this would be the case. I mean, the first time you go drinking, you don't know your limits yet. And not knowing your limits in combination with driving... let's just say, those 2 don't go together.

I'm in favor of lowering the legal drinking age. It's better to experience it at a lower age IMO, than to make a fool of yourself amongst grown ups.

I agree with magewout as well, and IMO, the legal driving age should be highered to 18.

And as for my embarassing story:
I passed out on new years in the club when I was 16. Never did that again rofl. Tho I didn't have a hangover or anything, but I could only remember a few things from the entire night. It's weird to wake up in your bed (naked lmfao) not knowing what you did. xD You're like: WOAH, I was partying a minute ago? D:
But, apparently I had a good time rofl ;D

[Shashakiro]

Re: Drinking age lowered to 18?

Being an adequate driver has barely anything to do with maturity.

This is an insanely false statement.

Studies in cognitive science have shown that most teenagers have not yet fully developed their functions for realizing the consequences of their actions--and this manifests itself incredibly obviously in driving, where it's really, really easy to be careless and reckless in ways that have nothing whatsoever to do with experience. It's obvious how important this particular function is in driving--speeding, running red lights, speeding, ignoring stop signs, speeding, taking turns too fast, SPEEDING--all caused by not considering the consequences. Not to mention seat belt use--teens use seat belts less than any other age group, which obviously has everything to do with maturity and zero to do with experience, meaning that teens who get in accidents are more likely to be injured in them.

Yes, inexperience is a factor, but claiming that maturity is not one, or is a very small one, is ridiculous. If anything, it takes even MORE maturity to drive safetly than to drink responsibly, not to mention that driving--even independent from drinking--is far more dangerous to others.

p.s. About 30% of teenage deaths in America are from driving accidents. Way more than ALL forms of homicide, for example, which is about 20%. You said it "works fine" in Canada--are these numbers different in Canada? How do you know it "works fine"?

[Jerry DB]

Re: Drinking age lowered to 18?

alchahol is bad mmkay

[Nyokou]

Re: Drinking age lowered to 18?

Thank God I'm moving to Canada in the next 2-4 years.

[OrganisM]

Re: Drinking age lowered to 18?

Raising the driving age to 21 is sometimes impractical when one is often expected to strike out on their own at age 18, especially for cities with poor public transport.

[MilkChan]

Re: Drinking age lowered to 18?

hhey guys remember when we banned alcohol it was called prohibition YEA THAT TURNED OUT PRETTY GOOD IF YA ASK ME .

They don't want to lower it to increase profits, they want to lower to decrease drinking related accidents. Less of a thrill or pressure to drink=less accidents. That's pretty much the only reason people drink underage for the thrill of it "being illegal". If it was legal at a lower age would there be more abuse? Also not to mention the whole "yeah yeah legal adult at 18 etc. but can't drink". Gambling is 21 as well but if you're near Indian reservation its 18 so that's a different story.


and anyone here who's like "omg ya lower it i can drink and look cool in 2 years ^_^ <3 im 16 btw" should shut up and leave because you don't look cool and you're dumb k


EDIT: Personally I find the whole 21 to drink thing pretty age demeaning and hypocritial.

[Mookage]

Re: Drinking age lowered to 18?

haha it already is 18 in Manitoba.

But on topic, I think the drinking age should be lowered to 16. At 16 I believe you have the maturity and intellegance to make appropriate decisions. Age of Sexual Consent is 16 in Canada, and I think if you are mature and responsible enough for that you should be responsible and mature enough to consume alcohol.

[Mans0n]

Re: Drinking age lowered to 18?

this thread got whored wow.

[Jokee]

Re: Drinking age lowered to 18?

It's already 18 here in canada but oh well, who cares?

[Mans0n]

Re: Drinking age lowered to 18?

Member

[gypsyboyPS3]

Re: Drinking age lowered to 18?

Quite ironically, when scientists compared sex rates from the 1970's to the 2005- era, the numbers dropped about 35% from 1970. So I don't expect much of an increase.

Neat!

Thank God I'm moving to Canada in the next 2-4 years.

WTF does that have to do with anything?

[OrganisM]

Re: Drinking age lowered to 18?

That's pretty much the only reason people drink underage for the thrill of it "being illegal".

Uhh, I'm not of age, and I drink because I have an appreciation and love of alcohol the same way "responsible adults" do.

On a side note, my family owns a plot of fertile land in Bulgaria, and perhaps someday I'll return home and start a vineyard there (far off dream, I know). There are grapes that grow only in that region, and they are simply amazing.


By the way, MilkChan, your arguments are so convoluted and unsubstantiated that it's difficult for me to respond. Use a little logic. And you're contributing nothing by calling people names. If you want to start that, I believe the proper application for a person such as yourself would be "retard". If you would like a phrase, I'll go with one from the late great George Carlin: "pile of redundant protoplasm".