Suicide

[Jam930]

tps...
Those weren't actually questions... but ok. More rhetorical or whatever.

Don't you think people should have the option of quitting?

I hope you realize that everyone folds under pressure.

I just get the feeling that you don't get it. Like in the movie Cast Away... that guy and his volleyball... you really think after years of sitting around on an island by yourself that you'd just be fine?
Let's say you keep on fighting... and don't quit.
80 Years later you're still there talking to your freaking volley ball. Noone can do that.

Now that's just boredom and loneliness... think of real in-the-moment emotional pain.

In any real interrogation, I bet they would snap you in a second. Cut off your fingers, your legs, and pump you full of some sick syrem(sp?) that will make every nerve in your head explode... then you'll beg for a bullet to the head... that's just physical pain.

Now that's just physical pain... think of real in-the-moment emotional pain.

Let's say you're in a car accident and you are absolutely paralyzed... your mother has to change your diapers and you're 40 years old. Noone wants you... you're a burden on society... you feel worthless and you feel powerless.

Sure... these are exceptions but certain people can feel these ways for all kinds of reasons that you, personally, don't think justify it...

I was depressed once... lasted over a year. I was just a mess... mad and sad all the time, tried to drop out of school... out of life... by doing so I just made everything worse and worse. I'm one of these people you're making fun of. Right now... I don't think I'm worthless... but sure... I was "weak" and an "idiot" and I tried to quit. Sure it was stupid... but I didn't care. What if I had "succeeded"? So I don't deserve anything at all... throw my weak, dead corpse to the homeless. You digust me.

[Tps222]

I respect your opinion Mal, but I disagree.

I would rather get raped and spinal tapped then comitt suicide. Die with a little honor, never give up, fight back. Suicide is for the weak-minded, and I have too strong of a sense of self-preservation. Killing myself would go against every virtue I have.

[-Skooter-]

RE: it would be usless to make suicide illegal

You're perfect

I know.

Secondly, no Jam, I wasn't joking. And Mal, shut up, your scenario sucked and here's why: Let's face it, You're completely making up shit out of your ass, to convince us that we're wrong. It's not working, so stop. We both know that situation is completely irrelevant to the CHOICE OF SUICIDE on a personal basis.

Now to clear this up:
I may have in fact owned myself, but keep it mind, it wasn't you that did so, and that's all that really matters. Quit your bitching. It's done. I feel how I feel, and TPS does too. You can piss and moan all you want, but the fact remains that people who commit suicide, are idiots, and wasteful idiots at that.

Like you said, I don't have much care for the needs of other people, also meaning I don't care about you, and how you feel about me, so stop attempting to make yourself seem as though you have some relevance or importance in my beliefs.

[StarmanSuper568]

I'm sorry of this is extremely offtopic and I'm really stupid at the moment but is there something that's opposite of depression?

[Tps222]

Content?

[chickendude]

happiness, its really a good thing

[AlbinoLime]

http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=depressed

Just follow his simple instructions. If you want to commit suicide, then do it. A lot of people who are that depressed let themselves get that depressed. If you are so caught up in your problems that you don't think there is any way out of them, then maybe suicide is the answer for you. Just make sure to talk to friends and family before you do it, because they might be able to help.

[Tokzic]

You're in a room with a man that's about to rape you. After he rapes you, he's going to kill you by sticking a long nail in the base of your spine and giving you a bathtub spinal tap. You have a chance to kill yourself to avoid the intense pain of him violating you, the intense pain of your spinal fluid running out. You only have the two choices: To get raped and killed very painfully or to end it painlessley.

Two choices? If you happen to be a shallow-minded fool.

Here's an idea - resist. That sick bastard must be pretty screwed up if he thinks I'm going to sit there and take all of that crap. That's the thing, Mal; suicidals think it's the best way out. It isn't. No matter what the problems you're having, the only way out is to try and solve them, and suicide isn't an answer, unless you're too weak to solve them in the first place.

[MalReynolds]

So, in the scenario that I created that has only 2 options, you can go and create more options? That's excatly it. Not everyone can do that, because not everyone is mentally stable. Insane people get locked away because they might harm themselves or others, depression is the same way.

And Skooter, get the dick out of your ass, ok? First of all: TPS, I'm fine with him. He said he respects my opinion, and that's enough for me to start respecting his. He views it as weakness, and for some, it is. If someone is not depressed and wants to off themselves, then it's not depression, Skooter. I mean, damn, I've been talking about clinical depression for a while now, but I don't know if that's what you're talking about.

There are 2 kinds of suicide: Free willed, which is where someone for whatever reason decides that they should be dead (IE, family getting insurance, sheer curiosity).
The second is depression, where the person CANNOT PHYSICALLY SEE another way out, and that is a sickness. Much like Cancer. People don't bring depression on themselves, just as people (smokers excluded) don't bring cancer on themselves. It's something that just happens.

And, Skooter, you have no room to call my scenario BS. And, yes, owning yourself is pretty sad.

Mal

[-Skooter-]

First and foremost, I never told you that I disrespected your opinion, as I don't disrespect anyones opinion. However, I am very headstrong about mine, and it isn't going to change for you or for anyone else.

Next, I didn't own myself, that's not logical, I was being sarcastic, and not to my surprise, you didn't understand it.

As for your scenario, I'm attempting to be very rash with you, in the sense that this is a forums board, and it is probably not particularly right for me to be mean, or hurtful to anyone, however, this is Critical Thinking, and I share even my harshest opinions freely. Face it Mal, that scenario was horse shit, things don't just happen that way.

How did you get in the guys house? Were you forced or did you choose to be there? If he forced you, how come no one noticed? If you chose, what in the hell made you think that was a good decision? How old are you? Are you a guy or a female? Oh, and another thing, even mentally unstable people are aware when someone is trying to harm them, and they are just as, if not even more capable of defending themselves.

The fact remains that no human, with any common sense, or above the age of 1 is not going to fight back. I doubt highly that any average person would choose to just kill themselves, before even making that effort. There is a scenario just like that one, it's called the Texas Chainsaw Massacre... and guess what? SOMEONE LIVES. They could've killed themselves....did they? No, because they found their life worth fighting for.

I know what comes next... this is what you're thinking of, this is what you're going to attempt to say so I'm going to eliminate that now... "Well, suicidal people don't find their lives worth fighting for"... Bullshit. Yes they do. It is human instinct to fear for your life, no matter how much "depression" occurs throughout it. I apologize for any emotional harm this may bring you, or anyone else reading this, but face the facts, No one really wants to die, and if they do, they're idiots to me for not being able to weigh out which is more important, and make good decisions. So no, I don't feel bad for them.

Finally, in recent posts you have decided that you are capable of evaluating how bad my bi-polarism must be, seeing as I am not upset and I don't attempt to kill myself. Guess what? I was told that I have severe "Manic Depression" The funny thing is, that the only reason they told me that, is because I can be nice, and then mean, for no apparent reason. Here's the deal: I get mad because something pissed me off. I'm not doing it for no reason, I know why I'm mad and that's all that needs to happen. I'm never depressed, and I sure as hell am not Manic. So the doctor has called my anger a name, and he has given me a label. Am I supposed to sit in a dark room for the rest of my life, with my head down and be alone?

Sure, things upset me, things upset everyone. I'm upset that Donald Trump and I aren't friends, but I'll live without it. My mom is a crackhead, My biological father is in prison and I didn't meet him til a year ago anyways, and my "Dad" is dead. He was hit by a car and put in the hospital for four years before dying on THANKSGIVING DAY in 2003. Swallow that shit. If I can do it, anyone else can. I'm not the least upset about anything that has happened to me, because that's how it was supposed to be, ultimately leading me to believe that ANYONE is capable of dealing with it the exact same way.

Ultimately, what I'm trying to say, is that I still feel as though they're idiots. Weak, idiots. If you don't feel that way, fine, I didn't say you weren't entitled to feel differently, I simply said, that if you expected other people to not have opinions or to be opinionated, then CT was not the forums for you. I'm not going to fight for your approval, I'm right to me, and that's what matters, to me. I don't need anymore friends, I think I can manage without you.

[Anuj]

Well... if you decide to make suicide illegal, then the failed "attempts" at suicide will get people arrested... So actually, it will affect some people... Let's face it, you have your emo kids who try to kill themselves but don't actually go through with it... Your attention whores and what not... They'll end up going to jail and stuff, heh...

And as for the eating corpses, that was OBVIOUSLY a joke, I am pretty sure that nobody posting in this topic approves of cannibalism... Use your heads people... And I'm on Skooter's side with the whole "suicide is for the weak" thing, even though I've contemplated suicide but decided not to... Was just a phase in my case I guess =P

[Vamps]

Skooter...you really dont understand what true depression is do you? You really cant seem to grip the reality that is clinical depression, TRUE bipolar/manic depression, or any other form of TRUE depression! Just because your dumb doctor told you that you were manic because u got angry on occasions doesnt mean that every doctor does so! True depression is caused by a chemical inbalance in the brain! How many people are going to have to tell you before you start believing them? Do you need to see physical proof? Go to some institute somewhere and im sure they'll be more than happy to show you pictures, graphs or diagrams of the brain of someone with TRUE clinical or bi-polar depression! You have the idea that it is something they choose to have...how can anyone choose being born with a chemical inbalance in their brains? I dont consider my life useless at all...and i have depression! I have very very very little food in my house at any time, but i dont complain..because i know that there are people that have absolutely NO food! I consider myself very blessed with an uncle that payed for my recent ski trip with my school. I got back yesterday...had a great time...i was smiling 99% of the time...even when i totally stacked it. He's also living in Hong Kong and is paying for the airfare and passports for both my mother and myself to go and visit him for a month! I have depression....i have previously felt suicidal...and yet i dont consider my life a waste! My mother is the same!
As for you being able to cope with all of your losses...that's YOU...you do not have a chemical inbalance in your brain that prevents you from coping! People with TRUE depression DO NOT CHOOSE TO BE DEPRESSED AT ANY STAGE! Nor do they suddenly start being depressed just because somebody told them they were depressed! They OBVIOUSLY had to have been getting depressed BEFORE they went to the doctors...or how the hell did the doctor diagnose them with anything? I can remember constantly feeling really really down all the time when i shouldve been happy....this was about 3 or 4 years before i was taken to the doctors..and i didnt even know what depression WAS! Your theory is excrutiatingly unsupported!
As for your stupid jokes previously....your not only hurting those that are depressed...but your also hurting those that are related to or very close to someone who is suffering depression or has commited suicide! And they CERTAINLY didnt choose to be effected by it! They certainly arent the weak ones....they certainly didnt say to their loved one "hey why dont you go commit suicide?"
The forum is called critical THINKING....which means you need to THINK before you post!

[Anuj]

You know... Just because a doctor tells you something, does not necessarily mean its true... People do have the choice, many people have overcome great obstacles in order to do whatever it was they wanted to do...

For example, Bruce Lee had an extreme injury to his back in the 70's. The doctors told him that he would never walk again. Did that discourage him? Nope... He did indeed walk again, and he did indeed fight again... Why? Because he chose to disregard whatever the doctor had told him, and take matters into his own hands... You can use depression as an excuse, or you can find a solution yourself.

And you guys are telling Skooter to be open minded, but are you guys really being opened minded yourselves, by only considering one possibility?

[MalReynolds]

Yeah, but it's weird. Considering only one possibility opens up a lot of doors for discussion while being open minded (in this case) is shutting most of them.

Mal

[Anuj]

Exactly, being close minded and only considering one possibility is what is making this thread so great...