Acceptable Suicide?

[kommisar[os]]

Re: Acceptable Suicide?

it's your life. do what you want with it. suicide is just another choice you make weather it be for good reason or by stupidity. Nobody else can make that choice for you.

[funmonkey54]

Re: Acceptable Suicide?

I believe that this wrong under all circumstances. When you take your own life you cause pain and suffering to the people around you. this is a self-centered and terrible thing to do. I believe that there is love in everyone. Everyone has somebody that they love. This person will most likely be the most effected by suicide. would you want that person to go through such an immense amount of pain and anguish that they may even consider making the same choice.

There is help for anything that you go through and therefore no reason for this. for example. say you were just dumped. you think life is over and it will never change. you consider suicide. this is ridiculous. even though you are in pain and are suffering with what is happening at this very moment there are others who have been dumped that can help you deal with it. approach the people that you know have suffered from the loss of a loved one or a girlfriend. ask them how they managed to get through it. this is free guidance that will help you deal with the loss.

after you have finished finding out how to deal with it pick yourself up and find someone else.

I believe there is always another way. suicide is unacceptable.

[OnixRose]

Re: Acceptable Suicide?

I don't know if I should post here or not(I also didn't read the other posts) but, just as someone can basically make his or her self ill psychologically, keep in mind who ever it is controls his or her thoughts

[[TeRa]]

Re: Acceptable Suicide?

I don't know if I should post here or not(I also didn't read the other posts) but, just as someone can basically make his or her self ill psychologically, keep in mind who ever it is controls his or her thoughts

People are not always in their right state of mind though, and do not always control their own mind pretty for the most part.

[arsonistsgetallthegirls]

Re: Acceptable Suicide?

I want to get back on topic for a second, because this bothered me when I reread this post.

In most cases, suicide is for the weak.

It takes a hell of a lot of courage to kill yourself.
Dying by your own hand, to escape the plights of this world, despite how people say "suicide is punishable by eternal damnation" and "There is nothing on the other side" is showing some serious strength.

People who kill themselves are in my eyes, only a tad less courageous than people who run back in to burning buildings to save infants.

[arsonistsgetallthegirls]

Re: Acceptable Suicide?

Forgive the double post, this is a different topic.

I believe that this wrong under all circumstances. When you take your own life you cause pain and suffering to the people around you. this is a self-centered and terrible thing to do. I believe that there is love in everyone. Everyone has somebody that they love. This person will most likely be the most effected by suicide. would you want that person to go through such an immense amount of pain and anguish that they may even consider making the same choice.

I believe there is always another way. suicide is unacceptable.

What if there isn't another way?
What if you have agonizing pain due to a inoperable brain tumor (far stretch, I know), but the doctors say you still have 5 months to live? (assuming you aren't a vegetable)
Is it still necessary just to wait it out because suicide is unacceptable?

[devonin]

Re: Acceptable Suicide?

Is it still necessary just to wait it out because suicide is unacceptable?

What I'd want to say to people who lean towards "yes" would be that the reason Euthenasia has its own word, and isn't just called suicide is that it is generally understood that the circumstances are different enough that many people would want a way to accept one without tacitly accepting the other, thus the second term.

If we leave suicide as seperate and distinct from euthenasia, does that change anybody's mind who was defending the acceptability of suicide? Does it change the mind of anyone who wasn't defending it?

[tsugomaru]

Re: Acceptable Suicide?

People are not always in their right state of mind though, and do not always control their own mind pretty for the most part.

What would you say would be the "right state" of mind. People who conform to made up standards made by made up ideal people?

I personally think that people who decide to commit suicide have justified their reasons in ways that make sense to them, they may not make sense to everyone else, but that doesn't matter. People don't commit suicide and make sure everyone understands why he would do it.

~Tsugomaru

[devonin]

Re: Acceptable Suicide?

I personally think that people who decide to commit suicide have justified their reasons in ways that make sense to them, they may not make sense to everyone else, but that doesn't matter. People don't commit suicide and make sure everyone understands why he would do it.

But is it enough to justify your motives to only yourself? Someone who murders having completely justified the act in their own mind are still held accountable by the existing laws against murder, unless their reasoning happens to coincide with the accepted justifications (Self-defense etc)

[tsugomaru]

Re: Acceptable Suicide?

It would seem so. The ones who try to justify it to others are seeking for attention and have no intent to commit suicide if they get what they want.

~Tsugomaru

[Mezo]

Re: Acceptable Suicide?

I wandered across... and I think I shall add to this.

We can always consider the events and feelings that can cause one to want to commit suicide, but try thinking about what the results would be to the person. We do most anything in order to benefit ourselves in some way, whether it be to feel pleasure, satisfaction, revenge,etc... or even some sort of feeling of being a hero (for those who have become martyrs) ... but the thing about death is that after we are dead, we can't benefit at all from these feelings or actually from anything anymore. People want to die in order to escape pain or in order to help another, but they pretty much don't know what is going to happen after that (unless u are a devout believer in heaven or hell or any other form of after-life).

Many seem to believe that when we die we will then be at peace and be able to think "hey, I'm not in pain anymore. this is great" or be able to look down upon the world after death and say "hey, I'm a hero. I did a good thing by sacrificing myself to save that baby." No one knows what happens after death, but I still don't think we will be conscious of anything and would actually be able to think of our lives... but maybe we can; who knows. This could be why so many people want to be remembered after death; it's almost as if they think their reputation will stay with them personally after death.

Another point is that people may want to die in order to help others; this is a noble act, but it only applies to you personally if you are alive. When you are dead you will not even have the ability to care about others (again, I might be wrong... if angels do exist ;P ) so, if u die sacrificing yourself, but you aren't able to save the baby, I don't think it will matter to you anyway; you'll be dead... no more emotions to even bother you. Sure the family of the baby will be sad and your friends and family will be sad, but you're dead... you won't care. I mean, if you say that suicide is very selfish, you are right... but most anything we do is to benefit us in some way, whether it be emotionally or physically. One could just as well run away from their problems and go live in a mountain and not kill themselves, but still cause as much emotional torment for friends and family.

When we can't handle our own emotions or physical pain we might sometimes turn to the idea of suicide.I know it sounds all selfish, but death is an escape from responsibility... just, it's not a wise decision to kill yourself if you think it will cause the pain to go away, because pain only exists if there is pleasure, and pleasure goes away too once you die. It makes me wonder what it must feel like to not exist as a conscious mix of body and mind. maybe you become one with the universe ... or maybe u just die and become dirt lol.

We, as humans, are probably the only species (on earth) who even ponders about death. Where we go after we die is an answer that evades us, so we make up a bunch of different ideas that could be plausible. (heaven, hell, purgatory, next life, etc) Since we only know about living, we relate death to some form of living... that is one reason why suicide seems to be a plausible way to escape pain. Suicide pretty much goes against natural instinct for survival, but we (and even certain animals) seem to do it anyway either to help species or survival or for no reason at all beyond personal reasons (that I can see) Death is a pretty scary thing and we are hardwired to avoid it... but we all know we will die one day anyway... so if a person makes a conscious decision to kill themselves, then I wouldn't say it is wrong. It is another decision, just the last one a person will ever make...

sry for the long post... I just have lots of ideas, just no one around here (school) who wants to argue about death with me :/ . such a depressing topic it is lol

[ledwix]

Re: Acceptable Suicide?

I don't see how suicide is courageous. I understand it takes a lot of "courage" to suicide, because of all the pressure mounting, but wouldn't it take a lot more real courage to suck it up and move on with one's life? People usually call people who face their problems and get around them courageous, not people who run away from them forever. It's much easier to inject some cyanide into an apple and eat it or steer toward a concrete wall while driving on the freeway than it is to solve one's major problems in life.

Saying suicide is always acceptable is saying people should reserve the right to suicide within their judgment. But if people have the right to suicide, then, IMO, there should be some sort of age requirement. (not that most suicidal people can make good decisions about this kind of thing, as it is) Like I alluded to before, a young child is too ignorant and naive to make major decisions about his/her life. Isn't this what parents are for: instilling objectives and moral values into their kids?

I'd guess it simply depends on whether we think anyone should have the right to end anyone's life, or whether we believe there's some kind of fate or grand scheme of things. In many cases, people believe people don't have the right to end another person's life at will; its murderous. In others, it's not.

[Mezo]

Re: Acceptable Suicide?

an age requirement for suicide ... maybe. nah that would just encourage the idea and make it seem like a normal thing to do... though other countries have euthanasia as a pretty normal and legal option. so I don't know. People should be allowed to do wut they want, but people are also stupid so we need to set laws for ourselves that are sposed to make sure we don't do more stupid things. Some people would kill and rape for no reason and kill themselves if they couldn't get the last popsicle from the freezer. Not everyone is as morally and mentally developed as some of the fine posters on this site

here's an interesting wiki on moral development. Some people never seem to get past the first stages, even when they are adults.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kohlberg's_stages_of_moral_development

[frickfrock99]

Re: Acceptable Suicide?

lol

[sjoecool1991]

Re: Acceptable Suicide?

In most cases, suicide is for the weak. For example, if a junkie gets AIDS from using a tainted needle when getting a hit of smack, then it's his fault. If somebody embezzles people and steals, yet bad fortune befalls him and he goes broke, and possibly caught, it's his fault. Those who commit suicide are cowards. They cannot face up to what they have done, and want an easy way out. The world would be better off without them.

But there is an exception, at least in my eyes. Have you ever heard of Huntington's Disease? It is characterized by a slow slip into dementia, it causes speech impairments, and extreme, shooting pain all across the body constantly. You linger for 10-15 years before you finally die. I once saw a moving documentary on a mother who lost her sons and father to this disease. Her father died after 15 years of developing the disease. She killed two of her sons after they screamed and begged for mercy, for her to kill them after suffering for years with this disease. She eventually did it. It was ruled assisted suicide, and she got 5 years, but served a 1/3 of it. She was not looked upon as a monster for what she did, in fact it caused a stir, and people went outside the courthouse protesting her punishment.

To be honest, that is a fate worse than death. Somebody with such a disease would rather die than live, as characterized by what I just said. Somebody who wants to commit suicide is not a coward when such extreme circumstances surround the situation and the individual. Now Huntington's disease is not the only exception, but suffering to an extreme like that is torture to the person. If you were being tortured, would you want to live or die? Exactly my point.

Also, not to exclude an important facet: Ritualistic or religious suicide. People who do such an act, such as seppuku, don't do it out of cowardice or because they couldn't handle life. They do it for honor, or religious reasons, and those people are exonerated, and possibly looked upon as heroes when they die. Samurai who committed seppuku were freed of any dishonor they got upon losing a battle. If their daimyos died, they also committed seppuku.

So in both cases, I do not see a person killing themselves a coward. They died because it was their obligation (Though others may not agree with it, but if they must do so by their code of honor or religion, so be it). And for the first reason...it's hard to comment on that. I nor you will ever understand unless you or somebody close to us was tangled in such a sad state. But really, other than the aforementioned exceptions, suicide is for cowards. Even if they were family, it would be a dishonorable way to go, and they would not be remembered well, even if their death is sad. (Or at least I wouldn't remember them well, I cannot speak for others).

This is largely an opinion, so please don't take all of what I said in verbatim.


~Bynary Fission

Huntington's Disease usually does not develop until later in your life though.
It is rare for symptoms to start showing before you are even 50.
It is also a genetic disease.
My grandmother has it.
And I am pretty sure my father does as well.
Guess what the means?


And no, I will not commit suicide.