Being saved

[u84]

Re: Being saved

Actually, I only read a few people's posts so I don't care if I'm repeating someone. The Bible actually says, it doesn't matter if you were a good person. If you helped everyone, went to church everyday and did anything religious-related, you still would go to Hell if you hadn't asked Jesus to save you of your sins and come into your heart. Likewise, if you were the world's biggest serial killer and you beat up everyone, you could ask Jesus into your heart and go to Heaven. Good deeds don't amount to anything unless you're saved. And yes, purgatory is a made-up place.

[devonin]

Re: Being saved

Likewise, if you were the world's biggest serial killer and you beat up everyone, you could ask Jesus into your heart and go to Heaven.

I've yet to meet someone whose christian beliefs I find -remotely- credible who would say that simply asking for forgiveness is a free ticket into heaven. You have to -MEAN- it, and since christians believe that God is all-knowing, I rather think he'll know if you're just trying to pull one over on him, and probably make your damnation worse.

Remember kiddies, Saying "I'm Sorry" and -being- Sorry are not remotely the same thing.

[u84]

Re: Being saved

I've yet to meet someone whose christian beliefs I find -remotely- credible who would say that simply asking for forgiveness is a free ticket into heaven. You have to -MEAN- it, and since christians believe that God is all-knowing, I rather think he'll know if you're just trying to pull one over on him, and probably make your damnation worse.

Remember kiddies, Saying "I'm Sorry" and -being- Sorry are not remotely the same thing.

Well, I am a Baptist, and of course you have to mean it. It's usually implied that everyone already knows you have to mean it.

[devonin]

Re: Being saved

Well, if you truly do mean it, and God forgives everyone of everything that they truly feel remorse for, and God will know, infallibly if you actually feel remorse...then how is it any kind of problem that someone who -had- sinned greatly can still be saved?

[u84]

Re: Being saved

Well, if you truly do mean it, and God forgives everyone of everything that they truly feel remorse for, and God will know, infallibly if you actually feel remorse...then how is it any kind of problem that someone who -had- sinned greatly can still be saved?

You're beggin the question. You don't go to heaven simply because you feel sorry. You have to truthfully accept Jesus into your heart AND ask Him for forgiveness. I'm not fully comprehending what question you are trying to convey at the end though. If I'm understanding it correctly, then I'm saying it's not a problem. I'm saying that no matter what you're previous actions, should you truly get saved, you will go to Heaven. If you read The Bible, you will see that the town whore of Jericho helped God's people and then got saved. Prostitution is a big sin, and yet she is mentioned all throughout The Bible.

[devonin]

Re: Being saved

Er...right...you just seemed to be arguing that somehow genuine repentance and acceptance of the faith getting previously "evil" people saved and into heaven was somehow a bad thing, like they had cheated by only repenting at the end.

[evilcowgod]

Re: Being saved

So, I'm just wondering, and I'm not trying to attack any religion or anything like that, this is just something I've wondered for a few months now and I figure the CT forum would be a good place to get some more open-minded points of view.. so here it goes.

This is from a sect's point of view that does not believe in purgatory keep in mind. Just heaven and hell

So, if you've never heard of God or of Christianity and you die, then do you still go to heaven if you were a relatively good person? If you go to Hell simply because you didn't worship God, but you still did your part in playing a positive role in society, wouldn't that seem cruel and heartless?

Or, if you haven't heard about God and in which case he says "Well, they never had the opportunity to hear of my word, and they were good people, I'll let em in." then...why do Christians continue to be so insistent on spreading the word? Isn't that like inviting people to Hell?

What is your guys's take on this? Cause in the bible it states that it is not by acts of righteousness by which we are saved, but by the grace of God. So, do our acts hold no sway at all? Especially if you were never "enlightened with the word of God"?

(tired, if any of this confuses anyone ask questions and I can answer them, it's not that I don't know how to word what I'm saying, it's just that I'm very tired at the moment)

So basically, do our acts mean anything? If not, then why do we bother, and if so, then why is worshipping an all knowing, all powerful, all loving being so important?

It's kind of hard for me to reply to this sense i'm a firm believer that there is no such thing as heaven and hell.

There is no heaven and hell as I see it, the good are rewarded and the bad are punished right here on earth.

[sherbtail]

Re: Being saved

Well here's my two cents

Babies and toddlers who die are going to go to heaven, or just die and don't go anywhere, like animals do. However this would mean they have no soul and that is a weird area especially as most christians believe that the baby has a soul at conception. But in the end, God is an all-loving God, why on earth would he send an innocent baby to hell, I know I don't want to follow a God that does that.

And Wlfwind, in reply to your other questions, if someone in the jungle has never ever heard about God and Jesus and grace and all that good stuff, then again I believe God will be fair, I don't know how it works, but I have faith in God that he will judge fairly.

And actions are not important in getting you into heaven, in my Anglican beliefs, because God knows you are going to be an idiot and slip up every day but accepting forgiveness cleanses us of our sins.

However, and its a big however, our actions are important in getting other people into heaven, if we act like Christians should, all-loving, all-caring, good people then others are going to see that in us and ask questions etc. and hopefully accept the faith themselves.
You could ask, 'but who cares about others, as long as I have my ticket into heaven?'
This is flawed in a million places though, firstly, everybody cares about their own family and friends, and nobody wants them to go to hell. Secondly, if you really did accept Jesus into your heart, then he's going to change you not to think like that.

Lastly, Ecclesiastes is amazing isn't it, it's my favourite book of the bible as well. But I would argue that it is God's will that that book is in there, and I would also say its a very true book, it says that the only thing worth having in the entire world is God, everything else is pointless, like chasing the wind. And if some of it seems to go against the teachings of God, then this is ok too, just look at the psalms, and at some of the anger and sinful thoughts within them. This shows how these bits of the bible were written by real people, with all the problems of today in their hearts.

Hope this has explained something

[Engler]

Re: Being saved

Well, this might already have been said, because I'm not reading the long posts. I am roman catholic, and we believe that if you haven't ever heard of God, but you are in fact a good person, you can still go to heaven. We pray and offer our thanks to God because we are thanking him for all he has given us. It's a little like this: What if someone was going to give you 1 million dollars. Would you take it and walk away without profusely thanking them and wanting to help them and/or pay them back? I think not. That is why we praise and thank God. He's already given heaven to us; we just have to be willing to accept this gift.

[shatteredgravity]

Re: Being saved

good works dont get you into heaven. believeing that you are sinful and asking God to forgive you, believe He died for you, and THEN trying to do His will and being the best person you can be? that added all together will work.

worshipping God is important because He made everything. you, me, your computer, your madd skeelz to play FFR, your significant other, food, the whole world. EVERYTHING. He sent His one and only son He ever had to suffer the cruelest death ever imaginable to die for you, for me, for all of us -- us lowly, stupid, sinful, undeserving human beings. if you run to Him and ask for His love and forgiveness and you keep living in Him, you'll go to heaven. God is awesome, and that word is overused too much. He's done everything and will do anything to pull you to Him. He loves you more than the en-tire world that He Himself created. thats saying alot.

you have to believe in God, love Him, go to Him, talk to Him, run to Him and worship Him ALONG with doing the best you can in good works. if you just do good things but never believe in God or anything stated a sentence ago.. it just doesnt matter. you'll be in hell, even if you were 'a good person'.

[Wlfwnd91]

Re: Being saved

I hate to reply to a bumped topic like this, however, I would like to encourage you not to religiously rant in a critical thinking thread. It's one thing to speak religiously if the topic calls for it, but what you did was.. preach.. pretty much.

You'll be ripped apart in CT if you do that, so just refrain. It is NEVER ok to preach in CT, under any circumstance. Have a great night.

[devonin]

Re: Being saved

*Rips the post apart in CT*

[slipstrike0159]

Re: Being saved

I hate to reply to a bumped topic like this, however, I would like to encourage you not to religiously rant in a critical thinking thread. It's one thing to speak religiously if the topic calls for it, but what you did was.. preach.. pretty much.

You'll be ripped apart in CT if you do that, so just refrain. It is NEVER ok to preach in CT, under any circumstance. Have a great night.

I sure hope you arent talking to me because i only gave insight into my religion which is what you asked. As far as everyone else you basically asked for us to talk about what we believe about religion as far as christians go so they are just telling you what they believe. If you take it as preaching then thats your own prerogative because the situation DID call for it seeing as how it was asked for.

Not like my long, time consuming posts earlier seemed to be noticed anyway...

[devonin]

Re: Being saved

I rather suspect it was addressed to the bump that was very preachy directly before his post.