Turning back time

[darkdieuguerre]

Re: Turning back time

Its funny how much time you spend writing nonsense. You have no evidence for anything and just make up everything and say there is evidence.

Its like when people say there is evidence of god and then never show any and just use that as their arguement. At any rate you still missed what i said so good game reach. Quit wasting your time trying to prove something that you cant get evidence for. Sure there has to be a point somewhere on a black hole thats the speed of light but you dont know where and if it goes beyond that.

The only information you have to go on is that its strong enough to pull in light. That doesnt mean anything.

Going on your style of reasoning i heard there was evidence that blackholes arnt holes and are just extremley dense matter that has a gravitational feild thats extremley powerful. Sure that might be true but what evidence. There is no evidence. I just made that up.

There is still no way to know something like that. Its just an assumption. It could be twice that. (Written by Kekiz)

In fact, you brought this upon yourself. You have been writing useless crap about claiming that the escape velocity of a black hole could be twice that, in fact where it could be. Let's take the IVT (Intermediate Value Theorem) and Newton's law of universal gravitation.

We know for a fact that light cannot escape a black hole at a certain point. Let's call the distance from the black hole to this locus of points x. Therefore, at a distance x, light cannot escape a black hole. Therefore, the escape velocity of a black hole is greater than the speed of light. Not equal to, since if it were, then light would stand still. Now, take distance x/2. At distance x/2, light cannot escape a black hole either, because it is inside the event horizon. Therefore, the escape velocity of a black hole is still greater than the speed of light. Now, according to Newton's law of universal gravitational, if we cut the distance between two points in half, we quadruple the force between them. (From here). Therefore, at a distance x/2 from the black hole, the escape velocity is at least 4 times the speed of light. Now, since light cannot escape a black hole at a distance x, it cannot escape light at a distance x-c (where 0 <= c <= x/2). This assumption falls logically from Newton's law of universal gravitation. Now, since light cannot escape the black hole at these distances, and according to Newton's law of universal gravitation, the escape velocity of a black hole as you approach the black hole is increasing (therefore, it is continuous). Therefore, according to the Intermediate Value Theorem, there is a distance k (between x and x/2) such that the escape velocity is twice that of the speed of light.

There is one flaw, this distance x yields an escape velocity twice that of the speed of light. Then, we double the distance x. If this still yields an escape velocity twice that of the speed of light, we continue doubling. If we are at the point where the escape velocity is always twice that of the speed of light, we have a contradiction (we wouldn't exist), therefore at some distance x from the black hole, the escape velocity must be equal to twice the speed of light.

[8Shade8]

Re: Turning back time

A. We know for SURE that black holes exist. How? Telescopes are so advanced that they can read radioactive signitures in the cosmos, and sometimes they find points in the cosmos where EVERYTHING (this includes light, particles, all forms of mass INCLUDING atoms) is being pulled to a point in the universe. When everything reaches that point it dissapears. Using a little common sense and some advanced mathmatical equations, scientists have determined for a FACT that black holes exist and their gravitaional force is so powerful that radiation traveling at the speed of light is pulled into it.

B. Scientists can measure the gravitational force, by determining the different speeds and masses of objects going towards a black hole. They have shown that even if we were able to go 930000 miles per second (which is impossible) which is five times the speed of light, we still would not be able to escape the gravitational pull of a black hole.

[darkdieuguerre]

Re: Turning back time

B. Scientists can measure the gravitational force, by determining the different speeds and masses of objects going towards a black hole. They have shown that even if we were able to go 930000 miles per second (which is impossible) which is five times the speed of light, we still would not be able to escape the gravitational pull of a black hole.

Now I'm curious, but do you have a reference for this claim?

[8Shade8]

Re: Turning back time

http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk/user/gr/public/bh_obsv.html

http://hubblesite.org/explore_astronomy/black_holes/

http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2001/ast12jan_1.htm

http://www.npr.org/programs/atc/features/2002/oct/blackhole/

These are urls that prove black holes exist. That fact was seen on the nasa channel. I wish I could quote the person, but I dont remember his name.

Edit: The nasa channel has stated that fact, and if you watch the discovery channel they have had an episode that stated that fact.

[darkdieuguerre]

Re: Turning back time

http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk/user/gr/public/bh_obsv.html

http://hubblesite.org/explore_astronomy/black_holes/

http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2001/ast12jan_1.htm

http://www.npr.org/programs/atc/features/2002/oct/blackhole/

These are urls that prove black holes exist. That fact was seen on the nasa channel. I wish I could quote the person, but I dont remember his name.

Edit: The nasa channel has stated that fact, and if you watch the discovery channel they have had an episode that stated that fact.

I meant proof that the escape velocity of a black hole is at least five times the speed of light.

[8Shade8]

Re: Turning back time

Yeah, that fact was stated on the discovery channel a few weeks ago. The episode was about the ten ways that our planet may be destroyed. Number 8 was a black hole randomly making it's way into our solar system. Number 1 was gloabal warming. I will try and find the URL for the episode for you, it may be on the internet...

[foolishwun]

Re: Turning back time

Default Re: Turning back time
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJoel View Post
All right. I've been thinking about... what if I had a sort of magic clock or something that I could turn back time with?

Would I dare to use it then... 'Cause I don't think you can "remember the future". I mean, if I turn back time, I wouldn't remember that I had done that. And then I would probably turn back time again, at the same time I did it last time. And then again... and again... And me, and everything else would be stuck in some kind of "time trap" where the same thing happens over and over.

Of course, noone would notice, cause noone would remember the future, but it's still kind of scary. What if you never could live your life fully :S And what if this actually is happening now, time turning back over and over. Maybe I've written this message... like 400 times by now? It doesn't hurt me, since I don't know but... what if?



Thecnichally you would remember that yo went back in time because, when you go back, you go back in world's time, and that's YOUR future. So if that's your future, after you travaled back in time you remember your past...











Here's a lil' time paradox:


The ball down the picture is going toward Port. 1, wich transports it in its own past, getting out of Port. 2, but if the ball that went back in the past hits the ball that was going to Port. 1 before it gets in it, it will deviate from its path and never enter Port. 1, but if it never enters Port. 1, it can't hit itself, so it will enter the Port. 1...


hmm..
well, maybe the ball coming from port 2 becomes erased from time the moment it interferes with its past self, but that wouldnt make sence because then the past ball WOULD go on to interfere with itself.
maybe since you are already breaking the laws of physics by going back in time in the 1st place, it would result in somthing that is as equally impossible, such as both occurances (the ball interefering with itself so that it never interefere with itself AND the ball going uninterfered into the portal) happens at the exact same time and 2 things exist in the same place

[foolishwun]

Re: Turning back time

also the only way to tell if your caught in a time trap or not is to live and see if you come across a magical clock and dare turn it back, if not, your living your life without time warping disrupting it

[darkdieuguerre]

Re: Turning back time

Default Re: Turning back time
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJoel View Post
All right. I've been thinking about... what if I had a sort of magic clock or something that I could turn back time with?

Would I dare to use it then... 'Cause I don't think you can "remember the future". I mean, if I turn back time, I wouldn't remember that I had done that. And then I would probably turn back time again, at the same time I did it last time. And then again... and again... And me, and everything else would be stuck in some kind of "time trap" where the same thing happens over and over.

Of course, noone would notice, cause noone would remember the future, but it's still kind of scary. What if you never could live your life fully :S And what if this actually is happening now, time turning back over and over. Maybe I've written this message... like 400 times by now? It doesn't hurt me, since I don't know but... what if?

Thecnichally you would remember that yo went back in time because, when you go back, you go back in world's time, and that's YOUR future. So if that's your future, after you travaled back in time you remember your past...

Here's a lil' time paradox:

The ball down the picture is going toward Port. 1, wich transports it in its own past, getting out of Port. 2, but if the ball that went back in the past hits the ball that was going to Port. 1 before it gets in it, it will deviate from its path and never enter Port. 1, but if it never enters Port. 1, it can't hit itself, so it will enter the Port. 1...

hmm..
well, maybe the ball coming from port 2 becomes erased from time the moment it interferes with its past self, but that wouldnt make sence because then the past ball WOULD go on to interfere with itself.
maybe since you are already breaking the laws of physics by going back in time in the 1st place, it would result in somthing that is as equally impossible, such as both occurances (the ball interefering with itself so that it never interefere with itself AND the ball going uninterfered into the portal) happens at the exact same time and 2 things exist in the same place

First of all, are you assuming that there would be two of you if you turned back time? If there were, what would the new "you" look like? If there weren't, what would you know? Would everyone consciously know that time was being changed or would a separate universe be warped out with the timeframe that you warped to? Or would time be changed everywhere in the universe? Your assumption of time changing on a small scope doesn't look at the entire universe. What else would turning time do? You can't simply assume that everything would be "normal", that would be very bizarre.