Africa

[talisman]

Re: Africa

well first off it would help us alot to find out what that number is... I tried looking for like 15 minutes but had no luck.

secondly, like any economic decision, there are advantages and disadvantages. What about our standing in the international community? What will other nations think when they see that the U.S. is pulling out its African AIDS relief aid? What about our interests in Africa? What happens to their willingness to agree to favorable trade agreements when we pull out the rug on their AIDS support?

[GuidoHunter]

Re: Africa

That first (well, second) question is a bit sticky. On one hand, nobody could really blame us for focusing more on helping our own people. The other hand isn't really relevant to the discussion, though, as it deals with us pulling our Africa aid for domestic priorities, when the more reasonable thing to do would be to reform our own systems and take money from other, more frivolous places before our Africa aid.

But our interests in Africa? The state in which Africa currently sits doesn't lead me to believe that they're in any position to refuse trade, especially with America.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

[jewpinthethird]

Re: Africa

All this jazz about "Americans First" is all fine and dandy and I totally agree that America should be focused on the problems in America, but that's kind hypocritical is it not considering the sh*t storm going on in Iraq? Yeah, you could argue the whole "war on terror" angle, but the rest of the World isnt buying it. We can waste trillions of dollars on a war that is getting us nowhere, but we cant spare some money for a cure for AIDs.

In all honestly, I think a majority of the worlds problems would be solved a lot quicker if the government would back it with as much force as they did this "war on terror." How many people die of Cancer each year? A lot more people than the final death count of those who died on 9/11.

I mean, if you really support this whole "fix america's problems first" than what's wrong with nuking some terrorist hotspots? I mean, the rest of the world is mad at us, might as well give them a really good reason to.

The problem with the countries that hate America is that they arent afraid enough.

[Tasselfoot]

Re: Africa

Hey Jewp... we weren't discussing that AT ALL. As such, it was never brought up.

I think that if it had been brought up, it would have been discussed in a similar manner. As a waste of funds that could best be used elsewhere.

So, yea... you went off on a tangent to answer a question that was never asked or brought up, and yet would likely have been answered in the same manner by those of us who feel African issues should be dealt by Africans. Then again, the one major difference is... terrorists attacking and killing Americans are coming from Iraq, Afghanistan, and other Middle Eastern nations. They aren't coming from Africa. Therefore, there is SLIGHTLY more justification for spending money on Iraq/Afghanistan than Africa, as it can be justified as spending to make American safer.

[GuidoHunter]

Re: Africa

We can waste trillions of dollars on a war that is getting us nowhere, but we cant spare some money for a cure for AIDs.

In all honestly, I think a majority of the worlds problems would be solved a lot quicker if the government would back it with as much force as they did this "war on terror." How many people die of Cancer each year? A lot more people than the final death count of those who died on 9/11.

We ARE sparing some money for a cure for AIDS.

As I said before, cures for AIDS and cancer won't come quicker the more money and politicians you throw at them. Anyone with the brainpower to find a cure is already working on one, and no matter how much money someone has, they're not going to get any smarter.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

[jewpinthethird]

Re: Africa

We ARE sparing some money for a cure for AIDS.

As I said before, cures for AIDS and cancer won't come quicker the more money and politicians you throw at them. Anyone with the brainpower to find a cure is already working on one, and no matter how much money someone has, they're not going to get any smarter.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

Well, what about the Space Race? Had NASA not had the extreme backing it did do you think the US would have ever made it to the Moon in the time it did?

I think if Al-Queda was searching for a cure for AIDs/Cancer the US would totally be pulling out the stops to beat it to the punch.

@Tass, my comment was directed towards Panda's comment:

Americans' first responsibility to Americans.

PS. Africa, grow up already. You're the cradle of civilization and you cant straighten your sh*t out yet? Yeah, Great Britian and France did kind of f*ck you over royally, but look at India. There on the rise. Come on, let's see some unity. Strike out against the man, not against your brother. Same goes for you the Middle East, your in the same boat.

[talisman]

Re: Africa

The state in which Africa currently sits doesn't lead me to believe that they're in any position to refuse trade, especially with America.

note how I said "favorable" trade agreements. My thinking is that if you've got a bunch of diamonds, and the US just pulled out its AIDS support, why not cut Russia a better deal for them? Or slap an export tariff on the ones going to the US?

I was talking to tass about this a few days ago and I basically think that it's virtually impossible to avoid globalization today... a nation as powerful as America simply can't afford to curl up and spend all of its money on itself, or it will lose its power. And decisions like giving foreign aid are very difficult to rescind for both political and diplomatic reasons.

But ignoring that practical reality, even in theory I think it makes sense to spend some money in Africa, fighting AIDS. Just seems like the (morally) right thing to do to me.

And don't be so dismissive about bringing up Iraq... talk about money that not only didn't need to be spent in the first place, but when spent was done so very ineffectively with little to no checks against for abuse by government contractors.

The connection between Iraq and Africa? Anyone remember one of the main justifications for the war? The supposed attempt to get yellowcake uranium from Nigeria? Yeah, the thing based on British intelligence that our intelligence doubted, that Joe Wilson publically disputed... followed by his wife's status being selectively and mysteriously declassified and released to only specific outlets in the press?

but it's late and I'm rambling... off to bed.