FUSE!! (79 or 77)

[hi19hi19]

Clearly, based on the activity in the tournament thread, a separate thread is needed.

My original opinion:

FUSE really isn't a 79 in my opinion. I would like to see it at 77 or 78.

If Reality is the standard for FGO speed, FUSE doesn't match up. Reality is like 3 NPS higher, that's huge. Both files are very obnoxious to PA so I don't think that argument or the fact that FUSE has 2 minutes of filler outside the hard parts realistically make it a 79.

Rebuttals to the 79 argument:

In regards to Fuse -> The first 1000 notes (before the 32nd stream) is a Mid FMO in itself.

The first stream is 2 NPS less dense than Purple, which is a 64. The patterns are fine. It's VC-level stuff.
The first section with jacks and hands is about 5 NPS less dense than the middle part of EHHS, which has similarly stupid one-handed patterns. If anyone can think of a better comparison, please do. Either way, the fact I'm looking around high 60s for files to compare that section to indicates that it's low FMO as well.
In general, before the 32nd stream there is nothing harder than a 72.

Once it gets to the 32nd stream it bumps to a high FMO which immediately transitions into a low FGO with that final 24th stream.

These streams are, as I said before, about 3NPS easier than Reality. FUSE!! is 120 bpm making the streams 240 bpm 16ths, which is almost 20 bpm less than the benchmark for FGO stream speed.
The fact there's a few minitrills and crossovers in them doesn't change the fact it's simply way slower than anything FGO.

The patterns may be easy for some to hit, but doesn't take away from the fact that the file is not easy in any regards because out of the 4 parts to this song all of them transition into a very low FGO. In turn a 79.

Based on comparisons to other files, the parts of the file are a VC intro, a low FMO chorus, a high FMO two middle sections, then a low FMO chorus again.
Where do you see FGO in that lol


In my mind the right place to put it seems to be 77. I actually score MUCH worse on Twister than I do on this, so it makes sense to be no higher than 77.
78 would be acceptable I suppose.

[j-rodd123]

Re: FUSE!! (79 or 77)

i would like to see a decent argument as to why it should be kept at a 79 first, my vote is 76-77

it really is just a test of consistency but the speed isn't even very demanding in the file and apparently the cyan notes can be cheated.

[SK8R43]

Re: FUSE!! (79 or 77)

If the cyan notes can be cheated please tell me how. Ive tried to hit them as hands, ive tried raw speed, ive even tried to jumpish them. My sightread 1-0-2-0 is exempt from this because i aaad all but the 32nd stream cuz im dumb but every try after that the solo is just pure evil.
Personally i dont care if it gets moved down, but ill have less motivation to aaa it seeing as i was going for scarhand on it(which isnt easy imo)
I'm going to have to agree with Krunky though, the file itself is a 72-74 then the 32nd stream hits and that ups it to about 75-76 because of awkwardness and the speed you need for it. Then the solo hits and its pure evil, hard to read, hard to hit, etc.
I think its fine at 79, but thats just me. I find it to easily be on par with the other 79's which i cant do ONE section in all of them(this is no exception)

I mean, this whole file is easy to dump goods on, sometimes i cant even do the intro without getting 1-3 goods. same with the ending.

[j-rodd123]

Re: FUSE!! (79 or 77)

the 32nd stream is super short though, how does that alone bump it up 3 points to you lol, it flows pretty well too

[xXOpkillerXx]

Re: FUSE!! (79 or 77)

hi19 has the most objectively correct arguments with his comparisons with bpms and fgo standards. if the file is weird to hit for Some people, it doesnt make it any more valid to keep it at 79. that being said, I vote 77.

[krunkykai22]

Re: FUSE!! (79 or 77)

SK8 yes the cyan notes can be cheated, jump them lol that's what I did until the last 24th stream upon which I actually hit them.


Hi19, I see what you mean, but I feel if anything (as I said in the thread) this could be a 78. The file just doesn't "feel" easy for one. The 32nd stream, while short, is still difficult. If we are subjective to difficulties based on playing them, I would dump 10-20 goods in this part alone if I didn't isolate that part. The 24th stream is extremely awkward at the end which, again, based on playing the file, is a luck draw imho. If you can hit the cyan notes, great, otherwise here's 15 goods just because... lol

This file reminds me a lot of Twister. Twister, to me, is extremely easy, even though I haven't AAA'd it, the patterns seem cheatable just like Fuse. If we drop Fuse, drop Twister lol

EDIT: I'm also not a very knowledgeable person when it comes to BPMs. I'm still grasping how to determine all that stuff and I won't be afraid to mention that.

[hi19hi19]

Re: FUSE!! (79 or 77)

Remember when using the "weird to hit" argument that Flesvelka is not an FGO.

If the cyan notes can be cheated please tell me how.

Each of them has a 1-frame gap with a 24th before or after it. Hit those two together as a jump; it becomes a jumpstream that's about 1 NPS higher than EHHS but you obviously run a greater risk of messing up your timing.
Conveniently, many of these wind up being [34] jumps and not split.
Not saying you have to do this to be able to play the file, far from it.
But the fact it's a realistic option is a further argument for bumping it down.

I think its fine at 79, but thats just me. I find it to easily be on par with the other 79's which i cant do ONE section in all of them(this is no exception)

There are also mid-FMOs that have "that one section you can't do"
*cough* MEPHISTO *cough* VALLISTA

Simply having a hard part doesn't make it an FGO, it's the hardness of that hard part (that's what she said)
And there's nothing about the most difficult section in FUSE!! that's higher than 78 at the absolute most.

[TC_Halogen]

Re: FUSE!! (79 or 77)

I would like to make a point about this file tonight after work; as you all know, I'm still in support of this being a Scarhand get at 79, but I'll take a much deeper and more objective look at the file when considering the difficulty a second time around, because this one could very well be incorrect at 79.

[j-rodd123]

Re: FUSE!! (79 or 77)

I would like to make a point about this file tonight after work; as you all know, I'm still in support of this being a Scarhand get at 79, but I'll take a much deeper and more objective look at the file when considering the difficulty a second time around, because this one could very well be incorrect at 79.

curious to see this post because i still can not for the life of me see this higher than a 77 at the absolute max

[Fantasticone]

Re: FUSE!! (79 or 77)

I swear Mermaid Island is harder then Fuse. But in a more statistical standpoint, Fuse has 20 AAAs and came out a day or two while Mermaid Island is at 28 after almost 3 years.

[Dynam0]

Re: FUSE!! (79 or 77)

I find it very similar in almost every way to Twister (77). There wasn't a single pattern that was awkward to hit but perhaps the 32nd stream is fast enough to push this to a 78. I really can't see this staying at 79 though, it's just...easier than every 78/79 I can think of.

[VisD]

Re: FUSE!! (79 or 77)

Nothing before the 32nd stream is a FMO lol. As a D5 bottom feeder, I can comfortably do the stuff before the 32nds. By way of comparison the ending jumpstream in Foam Born or the stream in Purple gives me serious problems.

I find this easier than Twister, because the crux of this file is all centered in one portion that simply requires capable speed and technique; Twister's all over the place with its rainbow bursts in addition to having certain streams that seem to be about as fast as the key streams in FUSE!. 77 seems about right.

[klimtkiller]

Re: FUSE!! (79 or 77)

i think it's a 75 maybe

[smartdude1212]

Re: FUSE!! (79 or 77)

I think I brought up Twister in the tournament thread and yeah there's no way FUSE!! is notably (or even at all) harder than Twister.

Twister has some interesting colour theory etc. that's really fun to hit but also reasonably awkward, it has some interesting hidden one-hand patterns, it has some occurrences of the cyan 'grace' notes (not really grace notes in the "Alice's Garden kill yourself" sense but more the "if this 24th stream were 16th stream this would look like an occurrence of a 32nd triplet so let's hit part of it like a jump anyway because we can thanks FFR" sense), and it seems like it's about the same BPM (idk how accurate this is though, last time I played Twister was on 1.3).

FUSE!! has the easy 16th fodder, the not-so-indexable 32nd stream for a bit (Twister has one of these too), and then some 24th stream with those aforementioned 'grace' notes where the majority of them are easily nailed by hitting as jumps anyway. I think that's about it.

I also brought up Pollyanna in the tournament thread, which has the 64th 'grace' notes in the jumpstream (just seems like colour theory to me) that one can easily hit as a 16th jumpstream. That file is also significantly overrated (or was, it might've been re-rated recently).

Based on what cornman has presented though, this definitely needs to be moved down. Hurry folks, get your exclusive Scarhand for a limited time only.

[yo man im awesome]

Re: FUSE!! (79 or 77)

Frankly the file isn't that fast. What makes it so difficult is the crazy patterns in the 24th/48th stuff in the middle. Even cheating the 48ths, those patterns are wack as fuck.

I haven't played it enough to give it a thorough look, but I would say it's best at 79. I think this is a good file to keep as a Scarhand unlock.