Originality an impossibility?

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  • Charlotte21
    FFR Player
    • Dec 2004
    • 83

    #16
    Re: Originality an impossibility?

    "Originality" is a human fabrication to seperate ourselves from others. It doesn't exist, your environment determines your actions. You have a limited number of decisions in said environment and will react to a stimulus based on habit.

    Six cats are thrown in the air. They cannot choose to do anything but either drop and hurt themselves, or flip around and balance their fall. Their options are limited to a very boolean system, or in other words: a resist or a comply. They can either resist or comply. The cats, having the habit of resisting injury, will fall. You can make these situations more complex and add in more variables but they melt down to the same cognitive decisions.

    It is amazingly simple to take every miniscule action and span it between the two poles 'resist' and 'comply' in response to a situation (which is imposed by environment). Simply: you can either be a person to resist something or comply with something, but either way you are constrained by the choices spanning between the two poles. No decisions can be considered original or creative. You cannot decide to be original or perform any number of actions thus making yourself original.

    But, since the universe is in a void, the universe itself may be original, because it has no restraints and no outer environment to determine it's actions. The universe as a whole is original, and by extension you could make the point that flamingspinach makes (I really like that idea.) but there's nothing you can do to make any difference in your "originality". You already have it, but not in the human sense where we want to set ourselves apart from others based on the difference in our actions.

    Oh-- and as for new thoughts. New thoughts are just the processing and reprocessing of thoughts about the world and reactions to the environment we see in nature. It may be possible for a thought to appear that hasn't appeared before in the history of human thought, but as information builds and builds and becomes more and more accessible, it is very unprobable that there will be someone who comes up with something that hasn't been thought up before. You could put your faith in Quantum Physics, but that isn't 'original thinking', that's just die-hard empiricism.

    Maybe existentialism was the last gasp for philosophy...
    Last edited by Charlotte21; 05-22-2006, 02:08 AM.

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    • Z3ratul
      FFR Player
      • Jun 2004
      • 940

      #17
      Re: Originality an impossibility?

      Good post Charlotte... and honored to see I'm on your Top 3 ^_^

      it's perfectly possible to be original... o_O wtf? The state of the universe is never the same, every second of existence is original
      I consider that to be no more than coincidence... a technicality really. That goes with out saying... and if one or any number of actions goes differently, that will still be the case. The only way to really disprove that statement would be if there were multiple universes / dimensions / timelines or whatever... but I think, for the time being, that's slightly out of our reach. What I'm saying is you're right no matter what, just the first one to say it here.

      "Originality" is a human fabrication to seperate ourselves from others. It doesn't exist, your environment determines your actions. You have a limited number of decisions in said environment and will react to a stimulus based on habit.
      There's a definition I'll be keeping with myself for awhile. It did cross my mind, that, like many things, originality is just another thing that feeds our human ego. I do agree that everything is situational, but I would still hope that if there was a congruent universe, that, given the same situation, I might actually make a different choice. I think not... but knowing (or at least thinking) I have the choice is ensuring enough for myself. Determinism really doesn't fit my fancy.

      Oh-- and as for new thoughts. New thoughts are just the processing and reprocessing of thoughts about the world and reactions to the environment we see in nature. It may be possible for a thought to appear that hasn't appeared before in the history of human thought, but as information builds and builds and becomes more and more accessible, it is very unprobable that there will be someone who comes up with something that hasn't been thought up before. You could put your faith in Quantum Physics, but that isn't 'original thinking', that's just die-hard empiricism.

      Maybe existentialism was the last gasp for philosophy...
      Again, great analyzation. Pretty much, I believe there's only three things I'm sure of:

      1) Everything (even paradox) is possible.
      2) Every possibility has a probability.
      3) I believe in my own consciousness.

      Anything past that, in my eyes, is assumption. Granted, I can't live day to day with that in my head, but it's still what I think. How this relates is that I think it's possible to come up with a new thought, just highly improbable.

      As far as existentialism goes... I think right now I sit on agnostic existentialism. It logically makes the most sense to me, in my own way gives me hope and motivation, and from a trivial standpoint, seems like the safest route as far as belief systems go.

      Everything else I didn't quote... no comment, just agreed.
      Last edited by Z3ratul; 05-22-2006, 08:32 PM.
      Originally posted by Grandiagod
      My father rapes me with logging equipment and my mother is a three legged grizzly bear going through menopause.

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      • flamingspinach
        FFR Player
        • Jan 2006
        • 270

        #18
        Re: Originality an impossibility?

        Originally posted by Charlotte21
        Oh-- and as for new thoughts. New thoughts are just the processing and reprocessing of thoughts about the world and reactions to the environment we see in nature. It may be possible for a thought to appear that hasn't appeared before in the history of human thought, but as information builds and builds and becomes more and more accessible, it is very unprobable that there will be someone who comes up with something that hasn't been thought up before. You could put your faith in Quantum Physics, but that isn't 'original thinking', that's just die-hard empiricism.

        Maybe existentialism was the last gasp for philosophy...
        On the contrary - every time someone thinks of a "new thought" i.e. one that hasn't been thought of before, it expands the possibility to combine that thought with other thoughts to form more "new thoughts". That's why, for example, our generation knows so much more than the last, whereas maybe 10,000 years ago people would know about as much as their parents did. The noosphere is growing exponentially. This is a vast oversimplification, but it's adequate for the purposes of this thread.

        Originally posted by Charlotte21
        "Originality" is a human fabrication to seperate ourselves from others. It doesn't exist, your environment determines your actions. You have a limited number of decisions in said environment and will react to a stimulus based on habit.
        Here you're basically making a statement about free will as a whole, rather than about originality, which is a small subset of it - and I agree with you completely. I invite you to examine this wikipedia article, which contains a perhaps more developed conception of this basic idea.

        -fs

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