The New "Religion"

[Arch0wl]

I'm Agnostic because all religion boils down to is what happens to you when you die, and with so many religions, how am I supposed to get a grasp of one to follow? My parents never FORCED their beliefs on me, so my whole life I've been able to believe what I want to believe. For all I know, every religion could be wrong and it could just be weird little tidbits from other religions, or, assuming Christianity was right, God could just kick us in the nuts and say "SORRY THEY MESSED UP ON ONE OF THE COMMANDMENTS WHEN THEY PRINTED THE BIBLE GG NO RE KTHX". And assuming a hell actually exists... no one deserves hell. No one. Hell, not even Hitler (CHILL BEFORE YOUR FIRES OF A THOUSAND SUNS HAVE BEEN ANGERED). Eternity is uncomprehensable and eternal pain and suffering is something that should not be put upon any being whatsoever. If you're going to be in hell for.. well, eternity, then why should you be punished infinity fold for something that's a tiny speck of the amount you'd spend there?

[VxDx]

Sadly, I agree with arch0wl up to the hell bit. (but it's sad to think that Arch is one of the few people who aren't OMG RELIGEEON IS TEH GAYZORZ I DON'T BELIEVE IN ANYTHING)

[Anticrombie0909]

What makes this country so great is the fact that you can believe in what you want. And anyone who doesnt believe that is ignorant.

I agree, wholeheartedly, and that's why the whole "NO RELIGION IN SCHOOLSS!!1!1!" movement pisses me off.

How about a no forcing your atheist ideas movement in schools? If people want to claim they want a live-and-let-live-world, they better start to live it themselves.

No, the whole "NO RELIGION IN SCHOOLSS!!" movement is all about giving kids the choice of participating in religion, not that they're offended by the religion itself (although many probably are). If you have a daily prayer in school or something, what's that one Muslim kid supposed to do? Or that one Athiest kid? The whole point is that they don't want to try and force beliefs on the kids, which is the whole reason I hate most organized relgion in the first place, because of the amount of emphasis they try to force on people to practice it.

[jewpinthethird]

What makes this country so great is the fact that you can believe in what you want. And anyone who doesnt believe that is ignorant.

I agree, wholeheartedly, and that's why the whole "NO RELIGION IN SCHOOLSS!!1!1!" movement pisses me off.

How about a no forcing your atheist ideas movement in schools? If people want to claim they want a live-and-let-live-world, they better start to live it themselves.

See, I have nothing against Religion in schools, but the problem is, there are so many of them. And people do not take Religion...lightly. So, in order to prevent problems, they just dont allow it.

But if my school offered a course on Bible Studies...or Religion Studies, I'd take it.

What do you mean by forcing Atheist ideas? If you are referring to Evolution, then I am going to have to disagree with you. Evolution is a scientific theory. So it would make sense to teach it in a science class. But no one is forcing it upon anyone. I mean, you dont have to believe everything a teacher says.

[Anonymous]

Sorry Laharl, but I'm gonna have to disagree with your opposition to ban religion in schools. Like jewpin said, it's largely a saftey measure to prevent students flaring up about kids with different religions.

Also, kids get a lot of their opinions and ideas from school. It's unfair to the child to expose them to religion in a biased sense because then they might pick up the idea there. This may seem like a pro-Atheist argument, but here's why it isn't: would you really want somebody to convert to your religion just because that's the only thing they know, or just because they feel pressured into it? Doesn't it carry a lot more merit if a person conciously makes the decision to pick a religion after thinking for themselves? I find that a lot more respectable, at least.

Additionally, you have to look at the Constitution, in the first amendment it says (essentially) that the government won't take any sides in religious issues and remain neutral. And since schools are government institutions that clause also applies to them.

Finally, look at how much schools and the government get away with being religious. Virginia has laws stating that: 1) all students must recite the Pledge of Allegiance once a morning and 2) the motto "In God We Trust" must be posted in plain-view in a high-traffic section of the school. Let me remind you that the pledge contains the phrase "one nation under God" and by saying that kids have to admit the existence of "God" (the Judeo-Christian deity), it'd be the same as if I said "there's a cat under the table" it's implicit that both the cat and the table exist. Anyways, the point is these are LAWS that our "neutral" government is forcing into "neutral" schools. It just isn't right.

It may seem that atheists are getting away with a lot, but in reality there's still a lot we have to put up with in a public setting.

Remember: by being neutral, that doesn't mean you have to say "I don't believe in God."
AND
Non-Judeo-Christians DO have to admit the existence of God in the Pledge and place their "trust" in God in the current "neutral" setting.

basically: It isn't neutral enough.

[peregrine]

the above was by me....

oy, it keeps logging me out when I write these long posts... anybody know what's up with that? How do I fix it? (besides writing shorter posts/typing faster)

[Laharl]

I'm Agnostic because all religion boils down to is what happens to you when you die, and with so many religions, how am I supposed to get a grasp of one to follow? My parents never FORCED their beliefs on me, so my whole life I've been able to believe what I want to believe. For all I know, every religion could be wrong and it could just be weird little tidbits from other religions, or, assuming Christianity was right, God could just kick us in the nuts and say "SORRY THEY MESSED UP ON ONE OF THE COMMANDMENTS WHEN THEY PRINTED THE BIBLE GG NO RE KTHX". And assuming a hell actually exists... no one deserves hell. No one. Hell, not even Hitler (CHILL BEFORE YOUR FIRES OF A THOUSAND SUNS HAVE BEEN ANGERED). Eternity is uncomprehensable and eternal pain and suffering is something that should not be put upon any being whatsoever. If you're going to be in hell for.. well, eternity, then why should you be punished infinity fold for something that's a tiny speck of the amount you'd spend there?

Then look into Mormonism. :P

"Hell" as people define it, the eternal suffering of someone after this life, is reserved for those that followed Satan out of heaven and those who witnessed the literal acts of God and denied Him still (say, Judas). We believe there are 3 degrees of heaven, and even the lowest of these, were man to comprehend it, they'd kill themselves right then to go there.

@ Peregrine and Jewpin: I'm not saying that they should endorse religion. That's not what I mean. I'm saying that the government is taking a stand AGAINST it, as in, they are not remaining neutral. If a kid is caught mumbling a prayer during the "thirty seconds of silence" after the Pledge, WHAMMO! SUSPENSION! That's bullcrap it my eyes. If the kid is bowing his head and not saying anything outloud, it's not a classroom disruption. No more than the tired kid that lays his head down on the desk is.

That's what I meant by "forcing" atheist beliefs. Just like they claim Christian people "force" that there is a God on them, they force their idea that there is no God on us.

Oh, and the concept of evolution is not atheist. Darwin was a devout Christian man himself. The idea that man came from apes, however, was not his own. People read that into his concept of "survival of the fittest" and claimed it was he that said so.

Also, while we're going over religion... I dunno why, but I thought I'd point out my latest entry in my webjournal. (Link in sig.) Go take a look if you want.

[peregrine]

@ Peregrine and Jewpin: I'm not saying that they should endorse religion. That's not what I mean. I'm saying that the government is taking a stand AGAINST it, as in, they are not remaining neutral. If a kid is caught mumbling a prayer during the "thirty seconds of silence" after the Pledge, WHAMMO! SUSPENSION! That's bullcrap it my eyes. If the kid is bowing his head and not saying anything outloud, it's not a classroom disruption. No more than the tired kid that lays his head down on the desk is.

That IS remaining neutral, as I said, that's the schools trying to remain neutral with religion. You can't practice on school grounds. It's not saying you can't practice AT ALL (which would be forcing atheist beliefs) it's just saying you can't practice at this location. It is in no way telling you what you can or cannot think, but only what you can and cannot do at that time.

There's obviously a conflict of interest between the politicians who make these laws establishing the pledge and the minute (or 30 seconds in your case, our school had a minute) or silence, and the school administrators who have to implement these contradictory policies.

[Cenright]

Sigh.... Where to start.... ok.

I'm one of Jehovah's Witnesses, so without a doubt I believe... no, I know that there is no hell. Death is the absence of life, which constitutes nothingness. There is no punishment worse than death. In revelation, the "lake of fire" is spoken about. If you read further, you see that is actually says "this means/is/signifies (I can't remember the exact word used) the second death." This refers to the second dying after the ressurection and judgement of those who did not make it.

There are two rewards for those who make are righteous (sp?). There are the righteous people and the exemplary who are concidered the annointed ones. The annointed will replace the 144 thousand angels that were lost and they will help god in heaven. The gathering of the annointed bagan at the beginning of the last days, which we have marked as 1914. The righteous will inhabit the earthly paradise. God said to Adam and Eve to 'inhabit the earth and be fruitful,' and that commandment has not deteriorated. It took a 'small' setback, but it is still the goal god has for mankind.



As for religion in school, I know that the schools are not allowed to endorse religous "traditions" or "rituals". That also means that they can can not put things on you that are against your religion, such as movies you find offensive or assemblies that you disagree with. I do not believe in christmas, and so when the christmans assembly comes around, I abstain from going in that building, and there is nothing that they can do and there is no action that they can take against me. Any attempt is unconstitutional. As long as your prayer does not break a school rule, you are fine. A silent prayer kept fairly small breaks no school rule I know of. And as I said before, any attempt to punish you for that is unconstitutional. If you take that up to the main office and lay that in front of them and prove that you broke no rule, they have to drop it.

Intolerance is everywhere, whether they are athesist or not; christian or not; there are always people who are intolerant. They have a church life and a non-church life. On constitutes a bible. the other is anywhere from intolerance to a gun.
Example 1: Northern Ireland - Catholics versus Protestants.
Example 2: Jeruselem - Israelis versus Palistinians. (Considered one of the most holy places in both of those religions; so holy they stain it in blood; some of it is innocent blood.)



Well, the world isn't getting any better.

[jewpinthethird]

@ Peregrine and Jewpin: I'm not saying that they should endorse religion. That's not what I mean. I'm saying that the government is taking a stand AGAINST it, as in, they are not remaining neutral. If a kid is caught mumbling a prayer during the "thirty seconds of silence" after the Pledge, WHAMMO! SUSPENSION! That's bullcrap it my eyes. If the kid is bowing his head and not saying anything outloud, it's not a classroom disruption. No more than the tired kid that lays his head down on the desk is.

I think that if a kid wants to pray at school, they should be allowed. I have never heard of someone being suspended because of praying. And if it did happen, then that is going against the constitution.

And I know Darwin was a hardcore Jesus Fan. I mean, he was on the path to becoming a Priest, or Minister,or whatever they are called. But Darwin is sort of the symbol of Atheism (well, the Darwin Fish is at least.)

But if you want my honest opinion (though no one asked for it) it is that Religion will led to the end of the Humankind. (save Eastern, and other Peaceful religions).

[Specforces]

The world is taking a stonger stance against religion because of the overwhelming freedoms that this country is giving us. People wan't to bitch, people want complain, it's human nature, it will always be. Prayer should be allowed wherever the INDIVIDUAL wants to facilitate it to his or herself, however forcing your beliefs on another is unconsititutional and is wrong. People should be allowed to pray in school, however they cannot use school as a mechanism to further their own religions, and the school itself cannot endorse religious groups, unless their activities take place before or after school hours, but only then.

[Anonymous]

God help you people, lol.

[Moogy]

I found the news about Sony in Laharl's journal more interesting than what he said about religion.

I think I'm going to hell.



Haha, but in all seriousness : I'm not exactly a religious person... there could or there could not be a God, I don't know. However, I believe in letting people believe what they want to believe and do want they want to do. If you're religious, I'm not going to launch into a diatribe about how "religion is wrong", because, honestly, I don't know myself. I don't believe there's a hell... in both of the scenarios (God or no God), there is either no hell because : God is supposed to love us eternally, and I don't think he would let us suffer for all eternity (what Arch said), or because, if there's no God, why would there be a hell? Logically we can assume that there will not be an "opposite" of something that doesn't exist. Anyway, just my two cents.

Oh yeah, and Sony sucks.

[Laharl]

But if you want my honest opinion (though no one asked for it) it is that Religion will led to the end of the Humankind. (save Eastern, and other Peaceful religions).

That's just ignorance speaking. There were just as many civil wars throughout the history of China and Japan, two very Buddhist countries, that were even more bloody than the wars in Europe. We just happen to have a lot more history of what happened in Europe.

The problem is the people BEHIND the religions, as I've said umpteenmillion times. Christianity IS a peaceful religion. But a lot of people in it tend to feel you are supposed to hate those that sin, which is just stupid. It says IN THE BIBLE to "love thy neighbor." Actually, I think the exact words are "love thy neighbor as thee love thyself."

In Matthew, there are some verses that basically say love those that oppress and oppose you, because even sinners and people without character can love those that care for them.

[whyareyourunning]

i am a strong christain and blah blah all of that. after raeding some of these posts, i have realized that i can be quite closed-minded when discussing my beliefs with someone of another religion/belief. it's true that hardcore christains truly are some of the best people on earth. before i started at my church, i had no real "friends", but these people have stuck with me, even when i have had doubts about what they and myself believed. and i feel that if i don't have the right to preach about my God in school, then they shouldn't be allowed to teach me the big bang theory and the theory of evolultion, because these are things that i don't believe in. thanks everybody for posting..some of you have opened my eyes about some things..i am not the only person on earth with beliefs..i am just hard-headed. peace be with you all ~~Samantha~~

abstinence will keep you safe!