Do you believe perception alters reality?

[Tsuguri]

I've often wondered about something like this. Like, is the blue I'm seeing the same blue as the one everyone else sees? And about when your eye sees an image, your retina (i think thats what does it) flips it over and such, so couldn't existence as an entirety be upside down? But then again, that's taking the conceded "we-are-man-we-are-the-highest-form-of-anything-there-is" view to the situation. So for all we know, WE'RE the upside down ones. Go figure. o_O


I love intellectual discussions. They can be so gratifying.

[jazzmosis]

I believe that, even if our brain didn't flip the image, we'd still develop everything the same - who cares if something/everything is upside down? After all, once our brain gets used to it, who cares?

[Tsuguri]

Agreed, it's just interesting to think about.

[IronMonk]

the colors you see are very likely differant to you then anyone else. think about this, what if you could see in infrared/ultraviolet? how would that change how you think/act

[Tsuguri]

Heh, I love tricking people with that by asking them how many colors there are in a rainbow. 8 out of 10 people said 7.

[peregrine]

Better quote.

"Am I a butterfly dreaming I'm a man...or a bowling ball dreaming I'm a plate of sashimi?"

Name the speaker and the work from which it was referenced. 100 credits to the first person who gets it, and names 5 major characters in the work to show they're not just Googling.

Of course that's gotta be Masa, cuz he ain't talkin about being the wind ; )

Anyways, you guys should look into David Hume's A Treatise of Human Nature he was an early pioneer of psychology as well as being an emperialist philosopher. Ultimately, we can't rely on anything to give us definite input, so we really don't know jack about what happens around us. Simple conclusion to draw, but he argues it so well, it's amazing

Also... for those of you who want a flat out answer, check out the Pragmatist branch of Philosophy. Basically it's this - does it really matter what the truth is as long as things end the same? Example: fate vs. free will... no matter what the case, we're gonna do what we're gonna do regardless of whether or not we were meant to do it. It doesn't give answers, but alleviates the need for answers, which is almost as good.

[Nightstar]

I had a thought kinda related to this once. It has to do with fate, and the illusion of free will. It was that, maybe everything is already done, and we have no free will at all. but it seems like it though, look, I will type a Q...I didnt have to do that, right? was it spontanious, or predetermined? I came up with an idea to explain this illusion. It is that out "consiousness" is 1/infinity-ith behind the present time, there is a delay. The outcome being that you think you are moving your arm, but you are really just experiencing it moving, to someone living life, it seems normal, but to some 3rd party, who can see in 4d, they see your path laid out, and you not having the ability to change it.

I am leaving out something important in explaining this....but I cant remember what. so this will probably make no sense. Now that i have read what I typed, I realise it is a bunch of bs, but at the moment of enlightenment, it was a rather profound idea. oh well. Damn this fate of mine.

[Cenright]

Here is my thought. I think it defines reality VERY well.

Perception does alter reality, but I'll take it a step further. Perception creates reality. What is color to a blind person? In their reality, colors do not even exist how is the reality of the color come into play to them? Someone who is dead has no reality at all. Some proof that backs this is our former member Monoc. He percieved his own death. Did it not become reality?

Can people percieve infinity? Think of something that goes back so far that it never had a beginning? It never started, but always is. Something always had to come before something else. Where did the universe start? If God exists, what did he do before he started the universe? And what about even before that? The human mind cannot comprehend the entirity of this concept. Because some people can't percieve him, God isn't real to them. This effects their entire world.

What about brainwashing through extreme means? I go back to the book "1984" for this. The world was completely different after the main character was brainwashed. His outlook, his very life was another life. If thousands of people think something, it will come true through just the massive motivation for the cause.

If everyone felt that man was an evil being that couldn't ever be trusted, Government would either be completely dictitorial, or anarchist. If everyone felt that man had some trust, then there would be large differences in the world. How did the USA start? How has the Democratic Republic worked? From trust that people can get things done through representation. No trust, and people would either not vote, or take matters into their own hands in revolt.



A person's perception makes their reality.
Reality is a culmination of the perceptions of all the people in the world.

Perception is the culmination of nature, your character, and your situation. These are channeled through your brain, and that is where all of your interaction is created. That interaction is how you help create reality.

[esupin]

it's like this- If you concentrate on listening for a telephone ring, you'll hear it.

[Afrobean]

a lot of really deep stuff

I agree with you almost entirely. The way you're describing it, it sounds like you believe that if something doesn't perceive it, then it doesn't exist. This can't possibly be right, and I will now attempt to explain why.

Imagine someone puts a piece of paper in a box and sealed the box. That box is then moved far from all living things. In addition to this, let's say the box was also sterilized to kill all microorganisms. So according to what a lot of people here have said, this paper in the box no longer exists? I don't think so.

I could be misunderstanding you all so don't spaz out on me if I am.

[Auranceus]

I am totally a realist, if i can see, it know it, or prove it exists then yeah, it exists. And thus, if it can be proven to be real then it must be. But i suppose that still leaves the problem of perception, but what does perception matter if it doesnt effect you, say for example you leave a pen on a desk on your bed, you walk away and then 5 minutes later realize you need it. So, if it didnt exist anymore how would you know its there still, but say it happened to be a phone instead, you arent there to actually see that it is a phone but it rings from there you hear it from there, thus it must still be there.

Also, "God" can't exist because there is no proven way to know that he exists, if he were like the telephone (as some freaks might proclaim that he talks to you and blah blah blah) and you could hear it but not see it as proof.

But at any rate i dont beleive that there is any way to prove that we are not someone elses reality (like the Cheng Tzu thing about the butterfly).

[IronMonk]

ahh immaterialist -vs- materialist debates are fun, but first i have to clarify something, hopefully everyone is a realist, you on the other hand are a materialist, you used the wrong term.

if you are a realist answer these questions.

what is more real

me, or you, (why?)

the room next to you, or the room you are in.

the house that i (me not you) live in, or the house you live in. (why)

emotions or thoughts .

a headach you are having, or the table in front of you. (why)

what if i told you now that i dont live in a house. or that i dont exist. did it change your answers?


just to play devils advocate, do you believe is microwaves, radiowaves, x rays. they all exist. you cannot see them either. thus god COULD exist, we just have no way of "seeing" it

[esupin]

but if you were a fox, would you even care?

[talisman]

The only real argument here that cannot be proved wrong is that reality exists differently for every person, and no one person can completely share the exact same reality as any other, and thus no one can ever be proved wrong if they do not allow themselves to be.

Therefore even if someone takes up a position of saying that this theory is completely wrong, they would still be adhering to the theory, and thus justify it.

Reality can only be one's observations and one's genetic material that influences the production of the chemicals which monitor the way one responds and records one's observations.

In other words, a person is what he or she senses and what he or she thinks about what he or she senses.

[IronMonk]

talismen let me guess, you are a materialist.

i find it funny that the one thing that is least universaly real is reality. no two people have identical realities.