Homosexuality.

[Relambrien]

Re: Homosexuality.

When humans are born, all humans have nipples, this is because the body at an early age has not been designated with a sex yet because it's completely random. After a sex is chosen, the required parts are thus um...grown.

Forgive me if I'm misinterpreting this, but are you trying to say that humans are born without a gender? Doctors can tell you the gender of your baby while you're still pregnant...

[devonin]

Re: Homosexuality.

A) Sex isn't "completely" random
B) Sex isn't Gender
C) Fetuses start out female, but if male, become so quite early on

[Corbin Wells]

Re: Homosexuality.

Forgive me if I'm misinterpreting this, but are you trying to say that humans are born without a gender? Doctors can tell you the gender of your baby while you're still pregnant...

No I mixed something up, gender is chosen while you are a fetus, that was my error.

[devonin]

Re: Homosexuality.

B) Sex isn't Gender

[Relambrien]

Re: Homosexuality.

1. Grammar
1. A grammatical category used in the classification of nouns, pronouns, adjectives, and, in some languages, verbs that may be arbitrary or based on characteristics such as sex or animacy and that determines agreement with or selection of modifiers, referents, or grammatical forms.
2. One category of such a set.
3. The classification of a word or grammatical form in such a category.
4. The distinguishing form or forms used.
5. The condition of being female or male; sex.
6. Females or males considered as a group: expressions used by one gender.

2. Sexual identity, especially in relation to society or culture.

3.
1. The condition of being female or male; sex.
2. Females or males considered as a group: expressions used by one gender.

I'm using the dictionary definition of gender that means "sex." I am perfectly allowed to do so in the English language.

Even so, elaborate please, devonin. I'm curious as to what you mean.

[Chrissi]

Re: Homosexuality.

No I mixed something up, gender is chosen while you are a fetus, that was my error.

As devonin is trying to subtly point out, you are indeed wrong. We are born without gender. Gender is imposed upon us by society. We are usually born with a SEX. Not a gender. Gender is most definitely not chosen as a fetus.

I think what you were trying to say was that, until a certain stage of development, female and male fetuses are identical except for the sex chromosome. We develop all the same beginning parts, and then the chromosome kicks in and (in ideal situations) starts signalling the releases of hormones, which influence our development from that point forward.

But we do all indeed start out more resembling females than males. However, we don't really have a sex until those chromosomes kick in and start signalling hormone production.

I'm simply presenting the facts as they are in every text book I have studied.

Oh and I think you're spewing bull****, because I'm a psychology major and sexuality minor, and what you're saying is not in any reputable textbook. You're just spouting things off trying to sound smart like you actually read this crap. You didn't. This is bull**** you came up with and are trying to pass off as fact. There is no authority who says that sexuality is binary. And if there is, you'd better show me right now, because they don't deserve the degree they have. And I will probably take it up with them. Because this is absolute falsehood and bull****.

Unlike you people I am not "dissing" anyone because of who they are, and I’m not putting any ethical or moral values I have into it.

I am not putting ethics or morality into any of this. You're simply wrong and lying in order to sound smart. You can't even spell the word "straight".

[devonin]

Re: Homosexuality.

I'm using the dictionary definition of gender that means "sex." I am perfectly allowed to do so in the English language.
Even so, elaborate please, devonin. I'm curious as to what you mean.

As devonin is trying to subtly point out, you are indeed wrong. We are born without gender. Gender is imposed upon us by society. We are usually born with a SEX. Not a gender. Gender is most definitely not chosen as a fetus.

The elaboration is easy:

Sex: Biological
Gender: Social

Your sex is simply a term applied to you based solely on your biological chromasomal characteristics. XY? Your sex is male. XX? Your sex is female. Perhaps Chrissi can elaborate for me if there are specific terms for XXY and XYY and the other variations? Sex is pretty consistant everywhere on the planet. Since the term is biological, it is basically universally applied the same way to everyone.

Your gender conversely is more of a set of sociological expectations tied to your sex, and absolutely can vary depending on where you live. In North America, traditionally the female gender role was one of submissive caretaking. Nurses are a female job and Doctors are a male job, blue is a male colour and pink is a female colour, Any behavior you are expected to exhibit, any quality you are expected to have is a quality of gender in your society.

[jecht3009046]

Re: Homosexuality.

XYY, I know is Meta-male. They have high testosterone and studies show that most end up in jail for overly aggressive behavior.

I forget the biological name for XXY, but it is a male that is usually tall and lanky, with other female-like characteristics. I don't think either has scientific proof that lead to homo/heterosexuality.

Also devonin, 2400 posts, join date 2004! Spooky!

[Chrissi]

Re: Homosexuality.

Perhaps Chrissi can elaborate for me if there are specific terms for XXY and XYY and the other variations?

XXY is Klinefelter's syndrome and XYY is just a random disorder in men. Most men who have XYY don't even know it. And we can't really tell how common it is because it doesn't really present any symptoms. You (if you're male) could have it and not know.

However, Klinefelter's is kinda bad. It leads to a whole bunch of problems. There are a whole spectrun of sex chromosome disorders which are just called.... sex chromosome disorders. There's everything from X to XXYY to XXXX.

There are also XY women who just have a disorder that inhibits the Y chromosome's action so they grow up female.... and then most of them realize they are actually XY at puberty when they don't get a period, or when they try to have children and find out they aren't fertile.

[Coolgamer]

Re: Homosexuality.

I usually like debating this, but the atmosphere on this site is touchy. Every day I'll be in multiplayer or video chat, usually multiplayer, and someone will call someone a ****** or say that they or their opinion is gay, and if I ask them politely not to act like that, then all of a sudden I must be a homosexual.

It's total bull****. I had to deal with a friend shooting themselves in the head because he was Christian and couldn't handle who he was, much less tell his family. He never told anyone at all.

Every time someone calls something gay or uses innuendo as an insult, I have to restrain myself from attacking them, or at least yelling at them. Anyone who thinks people would willingly choose to be attacked and persecuted for most of their lives is insane. It is not a choice. I never choose to like women.

And in court, the gay defense is often used. When some people claim they were attracted to a person only to find out they were really male, and somehow that makes it okay to kill or harm them.

Of course, if a homosexual kills someone in self-defense or who had been tormenting them, it's a different story.

Pisses me off to no end.

[devonin]

Re: Homosexuality.

Every day I'll be in multiplayer or video chat, usually multiplayer, and someone will call someone a ****** or say that they or their opinion is gay, and if I ask them politely not to act like that, then all of a sudden I must be a homosexual.

Well its a good thing that Critical Thinking is neither multiplayer nor the video chat.

[Dark Ronin]

Re: Homosexuality.

Oh and I think you're spewing bull****, because I'm a psychology major and sexuality minor, and what you're saying is not in any reputable textbook. You're just spouting things off trying to sound smart like you actually read this crap. You didn't. This is bull**** you came up with and are trying to pass off as fact. There is no authority who says that sexuality is binary. And if there is, you'd better show me right now, because they don't deserve the degree they have. And I will probably take it up with them. Because this is absolute falsehood and bull****.

I am not putting ethics or morality into any of this. You're simply wrong and lying in order to sound smart. You can't even spell the word "straight".

Wow you have serious problems. What’s up with you I mean seriously? I got that out of my text book so you’re obviously the one who’s BSing everything. Do you just have no life or what? If you notice I spelled straight in the world straightforward the other strait is actually a word, it’s just the stupid auto correct on this computer. I hate these things. But back to my point you didn’t even call me on the one big psychology mistake I made. Any real psychology major would know that my teacher couldn’t have studied under Pavlov. She studied under Skinner... I shouldn’t point this out since no one caught it, but if you even had a general psyc class you should know who Pavlov is. I have taken 2 honors psychology classes in college and scored higher than anyone has before me. My teacher did study directly under Skinner, so she was taught by arguably the best psychologists around. Of course as we all should know since you've taken so many psychology classes is that psychology is by no means an exact science. It’s still very young and we’re learning about it. There’s no reason anyone with any real knowledge of psychology would get so worked up over it. Oh and my last psychology book was written by Zimbardo. I'm sure you know who he is.

[Coolgamer]

Re: Homosexuality.

Wow you have serious problems. What’s up with you I mean seriously? I got that out of my text book so you’re obviously the one who’s BSing everything. Do you just have no life or what? If you notice I spelled straight in the world straightforward the other strait is actually a word, it’s just the stupid auto correct on this computer. I hate these things. But back to my point you didn’t even call me on the one big psychology mistake I made. Any real psychology major would know that my teacher couldn’t have studied under Pavlov. She studied under Skinner... I shouldn’t point this out since no one caught it, but if you even had a general psyc class you should know who Pavlov is. I have taken 2 honors psychology classes in college and scored higher than anyone has before me. My teacher did study directly under Skinner, so she was taught by arguably the best psychologists around. Of course as we all should know since you've taken so many psychology classes is that psychology is by no means an exact science. It’s still very young and we’re learning about it. There’s no reason anyone with any real knowledge of psychology would get so worked up over it. Oh and my last psychology book was written by Zimbardo. I'm sure you know who he is.

I caught your Pavlov mistake. I figured you were just lying to boost your argument. Are you saying you lied in an attempt to prove something? If so, it doesn't help your argument at all.

[devonin]

Re: Homosexuality.

Okay...That's quite enough of that.

Dark Ronin: Chrissi has proven her credentials more than adaquately over the course of her time posting on this forum. I know people at the University of Waterloo entirely independant of this forum who could easily compare for you Chrissi's knowledge of the psychology department of that University with the reality of their psychology department if you seriously need that to happen. She's called your credentials into question, and your response was to flip out, instead of rationally respond. Saying "Ahaha, I tricked you and you didn't call me on it" doesn't mean you tricked her, it means she had the decency to not call you a liar to your face in public. She simply called your textbook evidence into question. (notice that attacking what you say instead of you is logically more sound) If you have such insurmountable proof in "several" of your textbooks, post some of the text, let us know exactly which books you're consulting.

Chrissi: Seriously...there are so many better ways to try and prove your point than the way you went about doing so. You guys were both right on the borderline of sufficient personal attacks to just close this thread entirely, and now you've both pretty much taken a step over that line. This was a perfectly reasonable and interesting discussion. If Dark Ronin is so misguided in his claims, demonstrate where he's wrong, post some text (with a citation) from some of your books that state contrary to what he does.

I hate to close a good thread just because some people are being too overzealous in claiming they're right, instead of simply -showing- that they are right.

[Dark Ronin]

Re: Homosexuality.

Okay...That's quite enough of that.

Dark Ronin: Chrissi has proven her credentials more than adaquately over the course of her time posting on this forum. I know people at the University of Waterloo entirely independant of this forum who could easily compare for you Chrissi's knowledge of the psychology department of that University with the reality of their psychology department if you seriously need that to happen. She's called your credentials into question, and your response was to flip out, instead of rationally respond. Saying "Ahaha, I tricked you and you didn't call me on it" doesn't mean you tricked her, it means she had the decency to not call you a liar to your face in public. She simply called your textbook evidence into question. (notice that attacking what you say instead of you is logically more sound) If you have such insurmountable proof in "several" of your textbooks, post some of the text, let us know exactly which books you're consulting.

Chrissi: Seriously...there are so many better ways to try and prove your point than the way you went about doing so. You guys were both right on the borderline of sufficient personal attacks to just close this thread entirely, and now you've both pretty much taken a step over that line. This was a perfectly reasonable and interesting discussion. If Dark Ronin is so misguided in his claims, demonstrate where he's wrong, post some text (with a citation) from some of your books that state contrary to what he does.

I hate to close a good thread just because some people are being too overzealous in claiming they're right, instead of simply -showing- that they are right.

It wasn’t that I tricked her. I really did make a mistake. I thought my teacher had studied under Pavlov, I got the names mixed up it was actually Skinner. And yeah I did flip out, but I’m trying to present facts and she is just overreacting. I want a good solid debate; she just wants to yell at people. I don’t see how every text book I have read could be wrong. But I will bring in my text book tomorrow, give a full citation and type it word for word. Who knows maybe I misinterpreted it, I just don’t see how I could be that far off. I don’t try to sound smart on here this is how I talk. I can’t accept some random person who says everyone in psychology is wrong about it because he or she says so.