Drugs

[Vampeel]

Re: Drugs

As to suicide being illegal, how do you prosecute? Only attempted suicide is illegal.

You don't prosecute, but it is still illegal. (I don't get it but in technicality you don't have the right to do that since it takes away from society as a whole)

In the case of the 15 year old girl, she is not of age to give consent, period. Therein is the problem. The law determines that she is not of reasonable capability in mind and experience to make that decision for herself. So it falls to the boy having "coerced" her into the act. He is of "reasonable capability in mind" and should know better than to participate in the act with someone below the age of consent. So it isn't really so much that it happened, but that he allowed it to happen. So it's seen as her being taken advantage of by an older male.

This system has it's flaws but it is the system, and while age is not the sole determining fact of one's mental capacity and judgement, it does play a large part.

[Verruckter]

Re: Drugs

Actually.... drugs may have aided our development. Can you prove this theory wrong?

Atually no, but he didn't prove it right either. Also as stated in ther article, when our anceters stopped using the drug, they came back to the old lifestyle they had. Which means in fact the use of that drug had little or no effect on the humans we have now become.

I understand what you mean though.

[archbishopjabber]

Re: Drugs

You don't prosecute, but it is still illegal. (I don't get it but in technicality you don't have the right to do that since it takes away from society as a whole)

In the case of the 15 year old girl, she is not of age to give consent, period. Therein is the problem. The law determines that she is not of reasonable capability in mind and experience to make that decision for herself. So it falls to the boy having "coerced" her into the act. He is of "reasonable capability in mind" and should know better than to participate in the act with someone below the age of consent. So it isn't really so much that it happened, but that he allowed it to happen. So it's seen as her being taken advantage of by an older male.

This system has it's flaws but it is the system, and while age is not the sole determining fact of one's mental capacity and judgement, it does play a large part.

Basically I think the primary issue here is that the law of the land works against the people, not the people. I, being a libertarian, am disgusted by how little "rights" are given to the people. I think freedom of speech is the biggest joke of them all. Ask the little girl who made threatening remarks about the president in her myspace, fairly non descript ones at that and the cia came to visit her. They KNEW she wasn't going to do anything, it was just a case of our fascist government flexing their internet scanning muscles.

[Verruckter]

Re: Drugs

The question is: have you ever done that?

Not understanding it because you've never done it isn't going to convince anyone. I never understood why someone would want to get drunk until I tried it. Typically, one gets drunk for the first time as a form of experimentation (I wonder what it'll feel like if I have some more...) and then they discover that they enjoy the experience.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

But is the social pressure and context so strong that everyone must be tempted to do it? I mean, many times I have thought about trying weed or getting drunk, but I've never actually done it (Not that I didn't have the chance though, really). Personally I don't think getting drunk should be encouraged by anyone, it dosen't sound like fun to me at all. It's just not right. It dosen't make any sense to me that so many people enjoy taking a substance that makes them completely idiotic and without any control over their own bodies.

You see, I've been raised in a family where the only alcohol that was around was wine and sometimes beer. I had never seen someone drunk or high until high school and I was educated with principles of a certain freedom in what I could do. If I wanted to take a beer, I could just take one from the fridge and my parens wouldn't mind. My point is, I have never been tempted by any of these before, and I've come to the point where it actually makes me sad whenever I see someone I care for a lot drunk (let's say a girl I find attractive or a mate for whom I had a lot of respect). I don't actually know why I have so much hate for drugs. I don't really care if someone else takes them, it's none of my buisness and I'm not the one deciding for what the can or cannot do, but it still makes me angry inside. It seems my conscience can't accept the fact that drugs do exist and that people do take them.


Once again, My OpIniOn.

[Muffin Corruption]

Re: Drugs

I've come to the point where it actually makes me sad whenever I see someone I care for a lot drunk (let's say a girl I find attractive or a mate for whom I had a lot of respect).

I couldn't agree more with that statement... but it's odd for me.

I am not totally against drugs and alcohol, and I agree with the people that think marijuana should be legalized... in fact, it is safer than cigarettes. But whenever I see a person who I have a high level of respect for getting drunk or high, it really hurts.

Although, to tell the truth, I don't think it is the act itself. In my opinion, whenever one of my friends is going out and getting intoxicated, I generally worry more about the people they are doing it with (there is an excessive number of dick weeds in my town).

The personality of the person also comes into play... if it's someone who I think is doing it simply for the fun of it, and I think that they can distinguish between what's safe and what's dangerous perfectly fine, I won't even worry.

Sometimes I feel like a hypocrite for getting angry at drug users, because personally... it's something I wouldn't mind doing myself.

[Pippin667]

Re: Drugs

I more or less agree with the common statement that weed has never killed anyone, but alcohol has. But i dont like either, ive tried both but i only smoke weed when someone that does die, and i drink during partys, not just to get drunk. People get to dependent on both and lose sight of the who picture and reason they started doing them in the first place.

[kmj103a]

Re: Drugs

The question is: have you ever done that?

Not understanding it because you've never done it isn't going to convince anyone. I never understood why someone would want to get drunk until I tried it. Typically, one gets drunk for the first time as a form of experimentation (I wonder what it'll feel like if I have some more...) and then they discover that they enjoy the experience.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

I have only tried a little wine. But your right, I can't really say I don't agree with it untill I have tried it.

[MagicCarpetRide]

Re: Drugs

Would you rather be driving down the street in the opposite direction of a Drunk person or a high person (marijuana) ?

'Nuff said

[Pippin667]

Re: Drugs

indeed, lets all stay pure to ourselves for we will become smarter that way... or something like that

[GuidoHunter]

Re: Drugs

But is the social pressure and context so strong that everyone must be tempted to do it?

Not at all! You quoted me, but I don't really see any correlation between this statement and anything I quoted...

It dosen't make any sense to me that so many people enjoy taking a substance that makes them completely idiotic and without any control over their own bodies.

Becoming idiotic and without control is A) not something that always (or even frequently) happens, B) typically only seen when someone drinks WAY too much, that is, more than just getting drunk, getting WASTED, and C) completely unknown to the person drinking, so at that point it's hardly a decision.

Getting drunk usually makes things around you more enjoyable and gives you an interesting sensation that you rarely experience. On top of that, it can make other people funnier and more interesting. With some people, you just can't WAIT to see them drunk because of how hilariously they act (and not necessarily in an idiotic way). My roommate becomes extremely flirtatious when drunk. I just seem to get loud, but I'll occasionally do something out of character that amuses people, like shoving Amanda's face away when she tries to kiss me or something.

The point is that assuming that getting drunk automatically makes someone act stupid and irrational is an unfair categorization. Sure, that'll happen if people get stupid drunk (or rather quickly if someone's an annoying drunk, unfortunately), but you can be plenty drunk without that happening. That's the target area, and that's where most drunk people sit at, say, parties.

You see, I've been raised in a family where the only alcohol that was around was wine and sometimes beer. I had never seen someone drunk or high until high school and I was educated with principles of a certain freedom in what I could do.

I have, too. My parents were extremely responsible with alcohol and I never saw anyone who I could tell was drunk until college. Such responsibility has taught me to be responsible with alcohol, too. I'm not an alcoholic, and I rarely get drunk, but I don't see the problem with having an occasional excursion across the line, especially when I plan beforehand when I can and can't get drunk.

I've come to the point where it actually makes me sad whenever I see someone I care for a lot drunk (let's say a girl I find attractive or a mate for whom I had a lot of respect). I don't actually know why I have so much hate for drugs. I don't really care if someone else takes them, it's none of my buisness and I'm not the one deciding for what the can or cannot do, but it still makes me angry inside. It seems my conscience can't accept the fact that drugs do exist and that people do take them.

I know how you feel, there. I was the same way when I was underage, but I really don't have much of a problem with it now, since all of my friends can legally drink/get drunk. It's still really often unattractive to see a girl drunk, though.

Regarding weed, I've just learned to accept that people, including some of my friends, do it. My acceptance comes more from understanding that they're all big boys and girls and can take responsibility for their actions, which isn't something I assumed when I was younger.

I STILL have an issue with teenagers getting drunk and high and whatnot.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

[Pippin667]

Re: Drugs

dido, seeing a girl drunk kind of throws away all there purity in one glance.

[blissfulrain47]

Re: Drugs

Well for one thing those that do drugs often do hurt those around them. They hurt innocent bystanders when they decide in their intoxicated stupor to do something stupid. They hurt those who love them forcing them to watch as they hurt themselves. As far as liquor is concerned there are those who can be responsible with its use and those who can't. Usage of it can't just be ban it or don't. It's a long running part of our society. In fact alcohol at one point was illegal and it didn't work out too well.

My oppinion is that drugs and alchohol are horrible things most of the time.

[Pippin667]

Re: Drugs

There not good but there ok in moderation, like i previously said "good for special times like when someone dies (someone that was a pothead) or at a wedding or B-day or something"

[Verruckter]

Re: Drugs

Not at all! You quoted me, but I don't really see any correlation between this statement and anything I quoted...

I was just bringing another possibility, another argument.

Yesterday, I've been for the first time to a real party where lots of people were drunk and high. It has somewhat opened my eyes, yet I don't feel any less affected by the drinking of others.

Becoming idiotic and without control is A) not something that always (or even frequently) happens, B) typically only seen when someone drinks WAY too much, that is, more than just getting drunk, getting WASTED, and C) completely unknown to the person drinking, so at that point it's hardly a decision.

A) I was wrong about this, what you said is true B) Again agreed C) It's always someone's descision to get drunk. The person who drinks is entirely responsible for everything he does while being drunk, and has no excuse whatsoever. If the person gets so drunk that they can barely walk or talk (i.e. lose control over their own body), it's entirely their fault.

Getting drunk usually makes things around you more enjoyable and gives you an interesting sensation that you rarely experience. On top of that, it can make other people funnier and more interesting. With some people, you just can't WAIT to see them drunk because of how hilariously they act (and not necessarily in an idiotic way). My roommate becomes extremely flirtatious when drunk. I just seem to get loud, but I'll occasionally do something out of character that amuses people, like shoving Amanda's face away when she tries to kiss me or something.

Yes, but again the redundant question: Do you really need alcohol/drugs to have fun? I understand that some might want to drink to make everything funnier, but personally I don't need it and I don't see why others should either. As I said, I find it "anti-natural".

The point is that assuming that getting drunk automatically makes someone act stupid and irrational is an unfair categorization. Sure, that'll happen if people get stupid drunk (or rather quickly if someone's an annoying drunk, unfortunately), but you can be plenty drunk without that happening. That's the target area, and that's where most drunk people sit at, say, parties.

Maybe amongst your age, but with teenagers, it's a whole different story. I'm only 16 and so where most of the people around yesterday. Teens are a lot more difficult to control, and also have a lot less of self-control. They want to try new things without necessarely knowing what awaits them. Most of them fail at observing their environment and learning from mistakes of others. Some even fail at learning from their own mistakes.

I have, too. My parents were extremely responsible with alcohol and I never saw anyone who I could tell was drunk until college. Such responsibility has taught me to be responsible with alcohol, too. I'm not an alcoholic, and I rarely get drunk, but I don't see the problem with having an occasional excursion across the line, especially when I plan beforehand when I can and can't get drunk.

As for that, I guess I'm pretty much the same, with the exceptiont that I absolutely hate the taste of alcohol. I tasted everything there was at the party, and none of it tasted good. All the flavors were ruined by the actual alcohol (I tasted Baileys, Tornado, Amarretto and someone even had brought Colt45, which is the most discusting thing I have ever tasted.)

I know how you feel, there. I was the same way when I was underage, but I really don't have much of a problem with it now, since all of my friends can legally drink/get drunk. It's still really often unattractive to see a girl drunk, though.

Regarding weed, I've just learned to accept that people, including some of my friends, do it. My acceptance comes more from understanding that they're all big boys and girls and can take responsibility for their actions, which isn't something I assumed when I was younger.

I STILL have an issue with teenagers getting drunk and high and whatnot.

--Guido

http://andy.mikee385.com

It's not so much thatit's unattractive, it's more that it's rather sad. Last night one of my best friends (who's a girl) got really drunk and she couldn't even stand on her bare feet. She started crying and throwing up... It was awful. My other friend was so high he didn't understand a word I said. He couldn't place two words in front of another.

[FaughtNWon]

Re: Drugs

First off, i think that before any views can be propperly made by any individual, you must first try some of these things first. NO im not encouraging you to do drugs or drink, but i am saying that most people in this forum who have negative views twards drugs/drinking have most likely never tryed it themselves. Though i am not yet 21 i do drink and i like it. I JUST started drinking though and most of my friends already had ben drinking for awhile. I was alwase aposed to drinking because i have many drunks in my family. But after i learned more about it and tryed it i realized that its not the substance, but the will of the user not to abuse it. Therefor i think that good/bad can go either way. If you have an addictive personality, stay away, if you have strong mental ability, give it a shot before you say negative things.

As far as drugs go, i have tryed a few different ones, they all were pleasurable, BUT i didnt try any of them more than 1 - 2 times. With the exeption of marijuana. In all honesty i greatly enjoy marijuana and it does not effect me in any negative way. Its never lost me a job, or a friend, or anything. But all people react different to these things. In the end it comes down to you knowing your body and your limits.

And as far as illegal/lagal goes. I think that all drugs other than marijuana should STAY illegal.

=)