Do you see anything wrong?

[wildfireskunk]

Re: Do you see anything wrong?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Ages_(historiography) - For those who need a history lesson

Although Christianity was largely a direct factor in the coming of the dark ages and the surpression of intellectuals during the period, there's probably an argument to say that as a whole religion has done a lot of good over the course of human history in bringing people together and getting them to work towards common causes, as well as being key in the creation of earlier large empires. Hell, even modern ones have religion to thank for helping them be somewhat stable during their creation (although they've also caused chaos, but hey-ho).

I'd say it's give and take, but without it I doubt we'd be any further ahead than we are now. I still think organised religion is all bs personally though ^^

[Nullifidian]

Re: Do you see anything wrong?

I think that those common causes could well have been there without religion. Human morals aren't drawn from religion but drawn from the fact that if we don't work together we're only hurting our own development, and I do think the suppression of science through religion had an effect on our development. Truth is though, we'll never know if religion had the impact people claim it had because we only have one course of history which is with the involvement of religion. We know no other course of history so we can't tell for sure yet. For all we know the same good or bad could have come in a past without religion. But right now is a time where areligion is no longer punished as herecy and people should draw their own conclusion based on common sense and logic.

[customstuff]

Re: Do you see anything wrong?

She obviously needs that education she apparently loves so much.

[rushyrulz]

Re: Do you see anything wrong?

This is truly disappointing.

I'd like to return to this line:

I generally respect atheists for their beliefs, but when you go spewing out stuff like this it just angers me. It makes no sense and is 100% false-- and you know it.

and throw it back in your face since you clearly had no idea that the dark ages even existed.. I don't need to be a satan worshiper to look at scientific history and see that it got severely reamed by religion.

[VisD]

Re: Do you see anything wrong?

But right now is a time where areligion is no longer punished as herecy and people should draw their own conclusion based on common sense and logic.

We don't burn people at the stake any more, but it's false to say this. Secularist beliefs are still punished by the community within many cities and countries; the punishment no longer comes in forms as obvious as jail and execution but it's definitely still there in some places. I'm thinking more along the lines of social ostracism, discrimination and so on. Less blunt but more insidious

*edit: and we all know what happens to apostates in many Islamic communities

[Ohaider]

Re: Do you see anything wrong?

2012 internet religious based thread = disprove/downgrade Christianity thread

[Reincarnate]

Re: Do you see anything wrong?

[Pseudo Enigma]

Re: Do you see anything wrong?

"I dunno why it's so popular, man.. I was just trying to be the Tolkien of our time" -- Author of the Bible.
Yes, I know this shit happened before Tolkien. Get off me bro.

edit: at this point in time I think everyone who isn't a religious zealot knows that Religion is the biggest joke that Humanity has created. Why do you think we actually got out of that "Christian Dark Ages" time period?

[bballa48]

Re: Do you see anything wrong?

This is truly disappointing.

I'd like to return to this line:


and throw it back in your face since you clearly had no idea that the dark ages even existed.. I don't need to be a satan worshiper to look at scientific history and see that it got severely reamed by religion.

I know what the dark ages are. Initially I thought you were implying that we are currently (or quite recently were) in a dark age because of Christians.

Regarding the actual dark ages, I find it hilarious that you think Christianity is the reason that happened. A contributor? Maybe, I don't know. I wasn't there. But to say it is THE REASON that "science" (however you measure that... ) stalled is hilarious to me. There are so many factors that influence societal development, and you have no way of knowing whatsoever what caused what.

All I know is that the most successful country in the world was founded on Christian beliefs, and we have thrived. Christianity is not a poison. It is something that I personally believe in, and my belief is not ruining your life in any way. I am perfectly capable of understanding and utilizing science just like you are.

That fact that you get so defensive indicates to me you are pretty unsure of your belief. Why are you so defensive? I, as I said before, have no problem with atheism at all. Believing in a God is hard. There isn't anything to go by but faith, so I don't blame people for leaning the other direction. But why do you have to attack Christians just because they believe in something that has a positive influence in their life?

[foxfire667]

Re: Do you see anything wrong?

I feel that it is rather ridiculous people are still so close-minded about other people's beliefs. Although I really shouldn't put it past human society to shun anyone who doesn't conform to their norms. If you are religious or not, such factors should not determine the importance or overall personality of you or anyone else.

To say that you could toss a friend aside (or a potential love interest) just because of their beliefs or lack thereof, is considerably close-minded. Also no, the Christian religion doesn't have any sort of education standards attached with the faith, so I guess this person slapped that requirement on for some reason.

Also, why so suddenly must this topic be derailed into a religious debate? It never changes the outlook of anyone's beliefs, and takes away from the point of the thread.

[xXOpkillerXx]

Re: Do you see anything wrong?

Many "important" people have made religion an obligation for a whole society, which is wrong, that is maybe one of the causes of why some atheists will have a hard time talking to religious people about this subject. I have a question though (srsly idk the answer) : is there a place where every religion was/is banned by atheists ? Also, I don't believe in any religion but I'm okay with people who do, unless they try to make me believe they're superior to me just because of that.

[rushyrulz]

Re: Do you see anything wrong?

to say it <religion> is THE REASON that "science" (however you measure that... ) stalled is hilarious to me. There are so many factors that influence societal development, and you have no way of knowing whatsoever what caused what.

please watch

tl;dw: at least watch 27:30-30:50 and 39:09-end.
still tl;dw: Arabic cultures were making incredible progress in development of math and science until some philosopher came along and said math is the work of the devil and killed the entire movement indefinitely.

EDIT: I'm getting defensive because you're trying to shut me down by calling me 100% wrong when I'm not.....

[Reincarnate]

Re: Do you see anything wrong?

But to say it is THE REASON that "science" (however you measure that... ) stalled is hilarious to me. There are so many factors that influence societal development, and you have no way of knowing whatsoever what caused what.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giordano_Bruno#Imprisonment.2C_trial_and_execution.2C_1592.E2.80.931600

I need not also remind you of the stories of Kepler, Galileo, Copernicus, etc? The church authority had a deathgrip on scientific advancement.

How about the fate of 9th-12th century Middle East, which used to be the intellectual hub of the world? Ever wonder why we use Arabic numerals, or algebra, or algorithms, or why so many stars have Arabic names? What happened to completely halt all that?

All I know is that the most successful country in the world was founded on Christian beliefs, and we have thrived.

Do you know how America was formed, how we got the land, how we justified our expansion, and what we had to do to build ourselves up to where we are today? If so, surely you see why this sort of statement is *extremely* cringe-inducing?

Christianity is not a poison. It is something that I personally believe in, and my belief is not ruining your life in any way. I am perfectly capable of understanding and utilizing science just like you are.

Gay people would disagree with this. Women who want control of their own bodies would disagree with this. Educators would disagree with this. The list goes on.

Christianity (and organized religion in general) is poisonous and is demonstrably corrosive to scientific progress. Maybe *your* particular beliefs don't impinge on me in any way, but the problem is that Christianity, among others, is open to interpretation. That interpretation is used to justify pissing on everyone else. And yet, whenever you try to attack religion, it's the same response: "Hey, I'm entitled to my beliefs, as are you." The end result is religion being used to get away with anything while simultaneously being shielded from criticism and not beind held to the same standards of intellectual rigor.

Clearly, it's not something people are just going to sit back and take. Religion would be fine if everyone kept it to themselves, but that's not what happens in reality.

[Reincarnate]

Re: Do you see anything wrong?

wow epic videoninja by rushy

[Ohaider]

Re: Do you see anything wrong?

Everyone's been dumb for thousands of years, but you guys are smart so its ok (o:

This just in quote in thread that mentions religion turns into major religious debate

In other news, water is wet