Song Difficulty Changelog

**shenjoku** · 02-25-2015, 12:42 PM

Re: Song Difficulty Changelog

Go Beyond!! -Jazzy mix-, Diff: (86 => 85)
12 Bar Bloops, Diff: (84 => 85)

Not sure I agree with these ones. Go Beyond feels leaps and bounds harder than bloops. It's just relentless the entire time with it's difficulty whereas bloops has just one hard section really and that's about it. Does that really make it the same?

**TC_Halogen** · 02-25-2015, 02:37 PM

Re: Song Difficulty Changelog

Quite a few of these changes are not resonating well with me, moreso those that went up in difficulty.

A few drops are a bit questionable to me as well. I'll make a post about this later tonight.

EDIT: actually, I think before I make my post, I'm gonna do a little bit of data mining and see how things pan out from there.

**SK8R43** · 02-25-2015, 03:05 PM

Re: Song Difficulty Changelog

Originally posted by _Zenith_

This logic baffles me.

Just because I personally scored 3av 2 boos doesn't mean shit in terms of the file's difficulty to AAA.

1) It really isn't at all difficult. The reason I don't have a cleaner score is because I haven't touched the song since ~november/december last year.

2) The difficult reflects several other instances instead of just the scores that two players got.

No way in hell is TTE 80 worthy, especially with ketsarku/nomina going down which are two relatively harder songs than TTE.

Also: If 6-3-0-2 isn't close to an AAA, then you need to redefine the way you play FFR lmfao. Anything of SDG or less status is close to an AAA.

EDIT: With that being said, I leave with that being said. I won't continue a very pointless discussion that will get us nowhere.

lol what, Nomina and ketsarku are wayyyyy easier than TTE. I can jack very well, and my burst/roll skills are great but TTE is just more luck based. Not to mention the jump jack section to a burst roll is just lol
and no, 6-3-0-2 isnt anywhere near the aaa, not even 6 clean is near it. If you had a BF, then sure. But you dont.
All in all, TTE should definitely unlock scarhand, its definitely not that low of a difficulty. Its not like you can play it and just aaa easily like most of the other 79's, it requires tons of luck and skill.

**TC_Halogen** · 02-25-2015, 03:36 PM

Re: Song Difficulty Changelog

SK8R: your subjective opinion about files and your capability means absolutely nothing when determining difficulty. Just stop.

For the record, Time to Eye involves absolutely no luck at all -- if you know how to subdivide the 48th bursts into 24th note jumptrills, you will AAA every time; it's really that simple.

Gonna quote the list and give my thoughts about it; give me a little bit.

**TC_Halogen** · 02-25-2015, 04:20 PM

Re: Song Difficulty Changelog

Changelog (Difficulties 84-99)

Extratone Pirates (Drunk Optimus Remix), (92 => 91)

This one is tough to call. For a 92, it has a very simplistic structure, but sustaining a 16th note jumpstream that actually alternates accenting points 1/4 of the way through and gets interrupted by a 32nd wall is definitely FSO-material on its own. The fact that it's 16 measures at 250 BPM makes it under 15 seconds, though. The patterns are a bit rigid and occasionally force some 8th jacks, but it's not too bad. Both difficulties actually work quite well for me.

Serious Shit, (91 => 90)

I don't agree with this drop at all. Serious Shit might have a somewhat simple structure, but it is beyond unrelenting. Look at this NPS graph:

At a glance, it appears that roughly 40% of the chart runs at an average of over 21 NPS, which is absolutely unheard of even in the lower 90 range. At 230 BPM, having to contend with streams and jumps every 8th note (or worse on occasion) is rough for just about anyone. If the difficulty is dictated by AAA potential, note how there's only 25 full combo scores in the top 200 (9 of which are mashed), and 4 AAAs within that. By association, you have to be able to full combo to AAA, and if only 25 people have obtained only a full combo, that's a problem. This file should be a 91 at the absolute minimum in my opinion, both by objective and statistical reasoning.

Slashmaid (instrumental), Diff: (89 => 90)

I'm having trouble coming up with an opinion for this either way, only because I'm uncertain of what the tempo is. I know that the ending is well into the higher 200s -- feels like 270/280 BPM; that 8th jumping is pretty dense and tough to sustain without dropping boos. The first half of the file is pretty easy to snag bad habits, but the process of building bad habits is something that can't really be objectively measured.

Stinger, Diff: (90 => 89)

Definitely agree with this one. I have a little bit of weighting in full combo difficulty when it comes to ratings, and Stinger is quite a bit easier to full combo than the other 90s. It's actually got double digit AAAs at this moment. It's really fluent up until the ending, and a good majority of the bursts are manipulable, not that you would need to if you could AAA.

Music (For Kirby), Diff: (87 => 88)

I can't really give my opinion on this without bias. Of course I personally want this up to 88 given the speed of the jacks at the end, but justifying the 88 rating is somewhat difficult given the rest of the file is pretty tame. I can see this being 87 or 88.

Firstaidvision, Diff: (88 => 87)

I haven't given this an actual assessment/playthrough, so I have no opinion here.

grind2, Diff: (88 => 87)

I agree 100% with this being dropped. This file is definitely a cocksucker, but the difficulty is heavily concentrated in small areas, making the AAA difficulty relatively low compared to other 88s.

Fanteucpx[zv, Diff: (87 => 86)

24th note streams that are not immediately recognizable as manipulable, 250 BPM with respectable layering, and even in the short term, rather stamina draining? I don't think this should be dropped.

Our Journey and Epilogue., Diff: (87 => 86)

Absolutely not: the 16th note BPM equivalent of the stream at the end is faster than Extratone Pirates (170 BPM 24ths -> 255 BPM 16ths) and runs almost as long (only 2.5 seconds shorter). Additionally, the occasional three or four note 12th jumps with 24ths in between them is of course the equivalent of 8th note jumps with 16ths in the middle at 255 BPM. This file shouldn't be going down for any reason; if anything, it should be considered for going up in difficulty.

Go Beyond!! -Jazzy mix-, Diff: (86 => 85)

Indifferent. 86 works for difficulty being assessed with length and technicality, 85 works when considering that the file is reasonably consistent in structure and is easy to pick up on.

Zombie Sunset, Diff: (86 => 85)

Technical, but no extended streaming or extremely difficult bursts to get through. It's an all around consistency test, and the only thing that causes problems is the very end with the 24th roll; that's about it.

12 Bar Bloops, Diff: (84 => 85)

I don't agree with this, but I also don't strongly disagree with it. I don't have objective reasons for picking one or the other; subjectively, the burst patterns feel relatively easy and the file as a whole is tame aside from the occasional spikes/awkward patterning.

Storm Raid Battle, Diff: (84 => 85)

ffs thank god. The consecutive jumps that force a mini-jack that occur over and over again are very uncomfortable and easy to get boos/averages on. Additionally, the file as a whole just feels really rigid.

White Walls, Part 1, Diff: (84 => 85)

Didn't agree with this file going up to 84, and I definitely don't agree with it being an 85. It's long, but I can't really think of any component of this file that merits such a high rating. I was still fine with this file being 82-83... <_<

Breakbeat Acid, (85 => 84)

Absolutely. The layering on this file is super light and 250 with mostly single taps is really tame. I personally can see this file lower than 84, but baby steps.

Hero Reconsidering, (85 => 84)

Strongly disagree, especially when comparing right after Breakbeat Acid. This file has straining repeated taps, short bursts of actual jumpstreams, short walls; no way should this be an 84 if Breakbeat Acid is 84 as well. If this is 84, Breakbeat Acid should go down another point.

Milky Blue, Diff: (85 => 84)

The 32nd note streams are 294 BPM 16ths, and jumptrilling isn't a foolproof technique for this song given that it's only 147 BPM 32nds. I understand it's got 16 AAAs, but I just can't see this as 84, personally... =/

A Kidney Stone, Diff: (84 => 83)

Same deal as Milky Blue... inflated AAA count, but some of those players are inactive now and can't contribute to newer songs, making them seem lower. 210 BPM jumpstream for a reasonable part of the song is pretty tough, and intertwining with bursts and occasional polyrhythms is pretty tough too. The color structure of the file could be argued, but some people find less colors easier to read and others don't, so... *shrug*

Saddest RMX, Diff: (84 => 83)

This one is a bit more interesting to me, because I can actually objectively see this as an 83 myself. However, the statistics don't support it very well given that the song has 18 AAAs (one of which is an alt, another of which is questionable). Structurally, the only difficult thing in the file is the second half and the forcing of one-handed trilling and split-handed bursts.

**One Winged Angel** · 02-25-2015, 04:36 PM

Re: Song Difficulty Changelog

I'll address your post properly in a bit after I finish working on something, but I will say quickly that Fanteu + Journey and Epilogue play nothing like their intended bpms after being frame fixed. Fanteu I believe is 240 but almost all broken jumpstreaming segments now play as 225, and every instance of 24ths in the file is AAA'able (very easily) through jumptrilling, no working through any 2 frame gaps.

Our Journey and Epilogue was fixed in such a way (that I don't entirely agree with mind you, but eh) so that all one-handed biased parts in the ending jumpstream contain the least amount of one framers, which leads to a massive reduction in difficulty, much like TLDNE (before fixes this was actually an appropriate follow-up to Doppelganger in the tourney, and most D6+ players would probably agree that what's in game certainly isn't). The original conversion was definitely 88+ because it was constant 255bpm for the entirety of the ending jumpstream with no lenience being given for certain sections with specific patterns. This conversion isn't.

I don't think many players are aware that Our Journey and Epilogue was fixed in this way. I can guarantee that file will have close to 15 AAAs if more players that haven't touched the chart since its release try it again, which is extremely uncharacteristic of anything 87+.

edit: I'll also quickly add that WW pt. 1 bump to 85 is purely a statistical bump (hell I was the one that added this in game as a 79 or something lol, but only 6 AAAs in over two years? I know people probably don't play it often because loldoremarathons but the spikier 24th and 12th jumpjack sections are obviously more problematic than the current rating is giving credit for), and I'm fine with Breakbeat going down to 83

**Fantasticone** · 02-25-2015, 05:31 PM

Re: Song Difficulty Changelog

Serious Shit, (91 => 90): No what? lol. This is so annoying and semi fast.
Storm Raid Battle, Diff: (84 => 85): This is easy wtf?
To Make the End of Battle 79 -> 80: This is also easy.
Unicron Barbeque 80 -> 81: No lol.

**tosh** · 02-25-2015, 05:49 PM

Re: Song Difficulty Changelog

My personal thoughts that obviously don't mean anything but figured I would get them out there.

**mrpreggers** · 02-26-2015, 09:34 AM

Re: Song Difficulty Changelog

double helix needs to be an 85 what do you guys think leave a comment below

**PhantomPuppy** · 02-26-2015, 10:23 AM

Re: Song Difficulty Changelog

the only one i have an opinion on is into your eyes. it really doesnt feel like it needed to move up. i mean, its only 1 difficulty, but meh.

**rayword45** · 02-26-2015, 11:08 AM

Re: Song Difficulty Changelog

Things that need to be changed - BEER bumped a lot
Chik Habit 87 to 86 before This journey
mourning the lost 84 to 83 if return to fire is bumped down, otherwise stay
Goblin 84 to 83

**Mourningfall** · 03-7-2015, 08:05 PM

Re: Song Difficulty Changelog

My rank just jumped from 55 to 59, quit your shit

**Kanzas** · 03-7-2015, 08:13 PM

Re: Song Difficulty Changelog

Originally posted by Mourningfall

My rank just jumped from 55 to 59, quit your shit

1,600 to 1,641

**One Winged Angel** · 03-7-2015, 08:39 PM

Re: Song Difficulty Changelog

ok sure while I fuck around with some other songs at a lower level (because I know this is going to piss a few people off), ToY 88 or 89 discuss (valid points, not just yes/no)

I mean I already know how the discussion is gonna go for the most part, so input from mid D7+ would be very helpful.

**Deadlyx39** · 03-7-2015, 08:46 PM

Re: Song Difficulty Changelog

Originally posted by One Winged Angel

ok sure while I fuck around with some other songs at a lower level

I think Rat Twist needs to be moved down to a low-mid 40. That song is definitely not a 50.

Song Difficulty Changelog

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