Should the old FMO's have been downgraded to VC's?

[Niala]

This is mostly just to find out what the opinion of the FFR community is. I really don't understand some things about the change, too. Why is it the people who have absolutely no problem AAAing these FMO's who all support the change, and who get to finally make the decision? Also, the difficulty of a file is fixed, and the skill of a player is not fixed, so why can we change the difficulty based on "These guys are getting too good for it?" It seems to me that the logic behind a lot of this is just "The community is getting better therefore the files are getting easier," which, really, is just a huge logic fail. Why should I have to work harder to get an FMO AAA than you did when you tried to get your first? It's not different now than it was then, only we have more people who are able to do it.

[T-Force]

Re: Should the old FMO's have been downgraded to VC's?

Where's the screenies?

[Niala]

Re: Should the old FMO's have been downgraded to VC's?

*Points out that SK61 aka T-Force read the question wrong and the poll is off by one vote*

[kjwkjw]

Re: Should the old FMO's have been downgraded to VC's?

Also, the difficulty of a file is fixed, and the skill of a player is not fixed, so why can we change the difficulty based on "These guys are getting too good for it?" It seems to me that the logic behind a lot of this is just "The community is getting better therefore the files are getting easier," which, really, is just a huge logic fail.

Agreed. And even though I've gone through a few little skill jumps after the downgrading, the VC's that were once FMO's still don't feel like the songs that were originally VC's.

[awein999]

Re: Should the old FMO's have been downgraded to VC's?

with the addition of mirror, addtional speed mods, more time for the general community to get better, the general definition of what is for masters only or very challenging changes over time. CIA rave was once for masters only and that has no avmiss possibilities even when avmisses existed, so from what you say that should still be fmo but it clearly isn't. Where is the line drawn? It has to go somewhere.

[T-Force]

Re: Should the old FMO's have been downgraded to VC's?

*Points out that SK61 aka T-Force read the question wrong and the poll is off by one vote*

Bite me.

I evened my vote out, didn't I?

[AC1speakerbox]

Re: Should the old FMO's have been downgraded to VC's?

I get the feeling this is completely about being mad just because you can't AAA an FMO.
It's okay, I'll never see that day either. =(

[T-Force]

Re: Should the old FMO's have been downgraded to VC's?

Then why did kjw, who has AAA'd like 5 FMO's, vote for "no?"

[leonid]

Re: Should the old FMO's have been downgraded to VC's?

I voted for "no."

It isn't like some arrows disappear from the chart as the time goes by..

This doesn't mean I don't agree with recent downgrades for some FMOs, though. Some of them were actually easier than some hard VCs.

This problem can be solved if we abandon 1~12 difficulty scale and use relative difficulties instead.

[kjwkjw]

Re: Should the old FMO's have been downgraded to VC's?

with the addition of mirror, addtional speed mods, more time for the general community to get better, the general definition of what is for masters only or very challenging changes over time. CIA rave was once for masters only and that has no avmiss possibilities even when avmisses existed, so from what you say that should still be fmo but it clearly isn't. Where is the line drawn? It has to go somewhere.

I really do think that mirror only affects the file enough to have an impact on its difficulty on a very small number of songs. Plus I consider downgrading a way to keep the number of people who can AAA a song of a certain difficuly fairly constant, which really isn't necessary. Sure, CIA Rave might've been an FMO in the past, and so were songs like Delirium, but the difficulty scale now is fairly stable... and I don't see a need to stuff the VC range with more songs when other songs that are under 11 aren't being downgraded. If we were to alter the line between VC and FMO to fit "today's standards," we might as well need a complete overhaul of all difficulties.

[T-Force]

Re: Should the old FMO's have been downgraded to VC's?

That and you want a few more FMO AAA's, eh leonid =P

Lol, I kid, but Niala has some screenshots about an idea I had using the current system they have in the FFR Difficulties thread.

[Gigispackles]

Re: Should the old FMO's have been downgraded to VC's?

with the addition of mirror, addtional speed mods, more time for the general community to get better, the general definition of what is for masters only or very challenging changes over time. CIA rave was once for masters only and that has no avmiss possibilities even when avmisses existed, so from what you say that should still be fmo but it clearly isn't. Where is the line drawn? It has to go somewhere.

Okay. You do realize that it's been, what, 2 years since the whole avmiss thing has been fixed? So why only recently? And mirror does not add "skill". CIA Rave wasn't even that affected by the avmiss thing. Sprite made an Avmiss tourney and I tried the link he posted. I tried other songs than what he challenged us, and I performed similar to what I normally did on VC's and up. Except for stuff like Death Piano. I did the same on K1807 normally and with the avmiss, and my skill sucks too much to even say I could be good at it.

As for mirror, it was already possible. Rotate your monitor and I remember ther being an option where you could reverse the input of the arrows. I know not EVERYONE can rotate their monitor, but it was still possible. So why wasn't the difficulty changed when that idea was brought up?

I know I haven't been here for too long, but I'm getting tired of hearing the "avmiss" excuse. It's being used on almost everything when changing from a higher difficulty to a lower, aside from the songs made since.

From how I'm getting out of, people will think that if they change the difficulty to something lower, it's easier to FC/AAA. You can change the number, but the skill is THE.EXACT.SAME.FREAKING.THING. What's wrong with the number staying? Don't give an answer of "well why not?"

[Niala]

Re: Should the old FMO's have been downgraded to VC's?

i voted for "no."

+1

this problem can be solved if we abandon 1~12 difficulty scale and use relative difficulties instead.

+2

[awein999]

Re: Should the old FMO's have been downgraded to VC's?

what started to happen was that files were being released and people were complaining that it shouldn't be FMO because the general community is improving. And then we looked up other FMO's of similar difficulties and realized those should now be high VC too. I personally think the levels change corresponding to the number of people able to achieve or the levels have no meaning. It just makes sense to me. Silence is not fmo that's for sure and I have like 7 goods on it don't get me wrong

it's cool if you disagree with me I'm just putting out my opinion

[Niala]

Re: Should the old FMO's have been downgraded to VC's?

what started to happen was that files were being released and people were complaining that it shouldn't be FMO because the general community is improving. And then we looked up other FMO's of similar difficulties and realized those should now be high VC too. I personally think the levels change corresponding to the number of people able to achieve or the levels have no meaning. It just makes sense to me. Silence is not fmo that's for sure and I have like 7 goods on it don't get me wrong

Which, essentially, means that we rated songs too low, because the community was getting better. Those songs should have been given the same rating as song of their difficulty that were already there, not below them and had the FMO's that already existed dragged down with them.

EDIT: That's all this is, opinions. I'm glad we have people to bound opinions off of. If everybody came in and agreed this'd be boring. XP