Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

[qqwref]

Re: Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

- HOW MANY FILES ARE TOO MANY ON FFR?!

Personally, I don't believe there are too many files, if the files are each good enough that some people will really enjoy playing them. Maybe not everyone will agree that the files are good, but we could use some more diversity - some technical files, some bursty ****, some 13s, some straight up 160-200bpm js stuff, some very fast stream files. I'm sure you're all bored with some of these from playing SM for 5 years, but if there are only a few in FFR, we could probably use a few more.

And hey, if we keep up judging, we WILL get to 1500 playable files eventually. It could take 6 months or 3 years, but we will get there, so the question is just whether we're willing to let some of those extra 600~ be a little more controversial. Seeing as some files make it ingame and are immediately hated by half of the people, or else AAA'd and forgotten about, it can't be THAT bad to accept some files which don't get a ton of points...

[psychoangel691]

Re: Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

He's argued subjectivity tons of times but now you guys have this huge problem because he used my file as an example. It was a huge thing we argued when the batch was coming back around again.

Byron when you went through my file on aim with me I pointed out that you were going off subjective stuff and you even agreed after I pointed it out. I still have the conversation.

I didn't expect my file to get past you guys anyway and I don't plan on making those changes and resubmitting because they feel awkward and wrong. Plus if I did every change that every judge made it wouldn't be my file anymore I may as well just put all of your names on it.

This file made a good example because of the huge differences in judging. I don't think any two judges mentioned the same thing in it. Let alone that it got a rejected mark from one judge based on one thing mentioned in the chart, which I don't see how one thing in a chart should be enough to reject it but hey that's his decision to make.

All I know is you guys need to get off this it's just cause it's hers crap because it was used to point a valid subject out.

[bmah]

Re: Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

Wow, The Final Hour is the most hotly contested file ever. lol

Going back to what I said here, I see that this file is the forefront of getting down straight to the issue that plagues judging...subjectivity. This has little to do with the file itself. Ok guys, why can't we just take debatable files on a one-on-one basis.

Ok, how many of you would actually debate your files to be rejudged VERSUS letting go of a rejected one?

If there are just a few people, then a case-by-case discussion for problematic files should be manageable.

[AsphyxZero]

Re: Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

I didn't expect my file to get past you guys anyway

Then why did you send it?

[Dark_Chrysalis]

Re: Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

Just a thought here:


[<] The file was worth at least a [+.] rating, but there is already a better file for this song in the queue or in the batch, and the file is not suitable as a V2.

Wouldn't the < be worth 4 points (i.e. Famicom = 17 points)?

He did use the < symbol, but I think he still gave me a 3 rating on it... which is fine, but it brings up the issue that if I have 2 files with 5/4/4/3 in conditional queue, why wouldn't THIS 5/4/4/3 be in the same boat? Simply because our files were really similar and it would be unfair to the other person? Seems a little awkward...

[t-rogdor]

Re: Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

This whole argument is just more proof that most internet communities are based on people having Asperger's.

[AsphyxZero]

Re: Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

Aspergian's.

oh! the games we played!

[Plan_Bsk81127]

Re: Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

ugh, all this bitching about subjectivity is getting pretty damn annoying. Everyone is going to be subjective in some way when judging, you cant help it, thats just how it happens. People judging are supposed to look at files, pick out errors and give their thoughts on it. Being its their thoughts on the file of course its possible it will be subjective. That is why we have multiple judges so its not just one persons thought on a file determining whether or not the file is accepted or not. So how bout we drop the whole using subjectivity as your excuse for why your file got rejected or a certain rating and use the proper notes given and fix what was asked to be fixed in a file and leave it at that.

[TC_Halogen]

Re: Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

This is true however, most of us, including you, were being subjective in this batch in one form or another and used that as apart of your judging. I doubt this will ever change.


Doubt it.

I was subjective, but I'm capable of admitting that I was, and if you look at my notes, you'll even see that files with SUBSTANTIAL AMOUNTS of notes/fixes requested still ended up getting no lower than a [+?] because I'm able to separate between what should be there in my opinion, and what should be there in accordance to how the rest of the simfile is. Stop acting like I'm reacting like this because of this file - there's other files from the previous batch that got knocked down a ridiculous amount for stupid reasons, like song choice. There's even some files that had small amounts of errors and still got a [-].

But hey, I don't know a thing about judging or whatnot. I'm arguing with someone who thinks their opinion is right and nothing else because they couldn't even bother to address the issues that I pointed out -respectfully- like I asked to.

I'm done judging FFR files - if people are going to sit here and cut each other's throats off because they can't tell the difference between judging off of their preferences and what's right, then what the hell is the point. I love how the argument of subjectivity is coming out entirely because I choose -now- to speak up, rather than trying to focus on why people's votes are too -overly- subjective.

The rest of the judges can go have fun doing what they want. I feel sorry for the really strong judges who are consistently good because they know what they're doing having to deal with ratings that deviate ridiculously without justified reasons whatsoever. Apparently, getting a legitimate discussion when I actually asked questions about how to FIX something is a complete waste of time because some judges won't even bother to give a straight answer. What's the point?

Seeking perfection in simfiles is going to get you ABSOLUTELY nowhere because the users who are playing your game will not notice a good amount of the details that people are putting in.

Find another judge for me, I'm not judging on this team until I see a change in people's attitudes. It's not everyone, but there's people on the team who I simply don't agree with being on it for reasons of not being active with the site, not caring about the game, or not legitimately wanting to help someone out because they feel like flaunting around their elitism when no one gives a shit.

[bmah]

Re: Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

Complaint feedback form. If you care enough, fill out this form (not made yet though).

One on one basis for debated files (upon request) via PM or IM towards the judges in question.

Everything else is left as is.


simplicity is good

[AsphyxZero]

Re: Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

between judging off of their preferences and what's right

That's what judging is, though. The judges were chosen (at least some of them, I've never seen a couple of this people ever make a file before) because they know simfiling (lol nerd fucen status) and have done it for a while. They know what's fun and what isn't. From what I've seen from the judges thoughts and notes, they didn't find it fun/good.

[Patashu]

Re: Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

solution to objective/subjective debate: make judges assign two ratings

I think I've already posted this

[psychoangel691]

Re: Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

Then why did you send it?

Because I find it fun as hell as well as a lot of other people. It's got FFR file written all over it and really most of what's being nailed in it is purely subjective. As I said there were no two judges that had the same thing to say about it. Which means they aren't necessarily actual mistakes but just things that the judge didn't like about the file which is opinion. Which is why this subjective argument gets brought up again and again. There's just too vast a difference in opinions. In actuality what should matter is what the actual players want not judges who don't even play the game anymore or only play sm.

ugh, all this bitching about subjectivity is getting pretty damn annoying. Everyone is going to be subjective in some way when judging, you cant help it, thats just how it happens. People judging are supposed to look at files, pick out errors and give their thoughts on it. Being its their thoughts on the file of course its possible it will be subjective. That is why we have multiple judges so its not just one persons thought on a file determining whether or not the file is accepted or not. So how bout we drop the whole using subjectivity as your excuse for why your file got rejected or a certain rating and use the proper notes given and fix what was asked to be fixed in a file and leave it at that.

Being subjective and mentioning it is one thing taking a bunch of points off and rejecting a file for it is completely different. That's what he's trying to say. Where I just bolded as I said in my other post if I were to make every change to my file that each judge made my entire file would be different. It wouldn't be mine anymore it may as well have their names on it. Every judge had something different to say all throughout the file. So you tell me how I'm supposed to please all of them and still have the file feel like it's what I created in the 1st place.

Going back to what I said here, I see that this file

The only reason this file is sparking anything is because it was used as an example and because it's mine it's automatically assumed that it's because we're together and not that it was simply being used to prove a point of something he's argued several times but apparently no one remembers that.

[t-rogdor]

Re: Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

Psychoangel doesn't want to fix her file because it won't be her file anymore? when i step a file and submit it to a pack, i expect things to be wrong with it and fix them. that doesn't make it not my file. if everyone had Psychoangel's mentality, nobody would fix any files because they wouldn't be theirs anymore. That's ****ing stupid.

PS, AJ, you said, outright that you wanted her file in the game and that was why you were defending it. You're more "subjective" than the judges themselves. h0h.




p.p.s: Judging is supposed to be subjective.

[dore]

Re: Queue/Batch Discussion Thread

4AM Q/B thread drama... oh yeah