Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR

[bmah]

Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR

can one of the admins comment on what osu! is doing and how it compares to FFR in terms of using copyright material? this is a pretty big deal and it could mean a lot for FFR's future.

I have yet to acquaint myself with osu!-related material, but from what you guys have been describing, it sounds (in regards to degree of legality) no different than having a simfile database where people freely put up songs they've stepped. Pretty much every major simfile database has been gone over the past several years, so that says something about osu!

i wouldn't mind some kind of agreement like the one you described between ffr and the simfile author as a supplement to the already in-place permission system.

Not a bad idea. I just hope it doesn't get out of hand though with everyone taking that sort of risk just to step whatever they want from any artist.

Keybeat was infinitely smaller than osu! when it was told to take down the konami/bemani songs

No, from what I recall, stargroup took down Konami songs on his own accord due to not wanting to take any chances (that's what he told me when I asked him why years ago). Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think he received any demands to take them down by force.

[alloyus]

Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR

Oh wow I honestly thought there was a post about it or something and they were doing it a little bit at a time, sorry about that x.x

[Fission]

Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR

Pretty much every major simfile database has been gone over the past several years, so that says something about osu!

i think it's because osu! doesn't host any of it's files centrally like these databases did, so it can't be held liable. ffr could adopt this approach, but it would force people to download simfiles to their computer instead of using the convenience of loading them in flash.

EDIT: osu! might actually host these files centrally, but it has proven to be resilient much in the same way sites like mega.co.nz are (they forfeit all responsibility)

[yo man im awesome]

Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR

i think it's because osu! doesn't host any of it's files centrally like these databases did, so it can't be held liable. ffr could adopt this approach, but it would force people to download simfiles to their computer instead of using the convenience of loading them in flash.

nty

[benguino]

Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR

Decided to scour more of the osu forums, I'm pretty bad at searching so this is pretty much everything you're gonna see from their side. Don't know if this will give anyone more insight or not on the situation.

https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/t/107567?hilit=+illegal

https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/t/30831?hilit=+copyright

https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/t/65442?hilit=+copyright

https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/t/116468?hilit=+copyright

https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/t/140636?hilit=+copyright

[Fission]

Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR

nty

it's a pretty significant downside, i agree. i don't think it's the right direction for ffr either. just a possible alternative, that's all.

[qqwref]

Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR

While FFR may fall under fair use, keep in mind that companies can and will pull a copyright claim on you even if you are using their work fairly. Look at all the youtube videos that are technically fair use but are taken down for copyright reasons. And if they do take legal action, either you have to hire a good lawyer and plead your case in court - and hope the judge agrees with you, because otherwise you will have to pay a LOT of money - or come to a smaller, but still significant, settlement. Basically my point is that, just because the law is on your side, doesn't mean what you're doing is a good idea.

tl;dr let's keep getting proper permissions

[Xiz]

Re: Fair Use / Copyright Law & FFR

Not a bad idea. I just hope it doesn't get out of hand though with everyone taking that sort of risk just to step whatever they want from any artist.

I guess what could happen is when a user submits to the batch, they send screenshots / emails showing their attempts at contacting them. (And this will be iffy to decide what is legit or not, but professional email adresses / agrents / record labels, etc)

While FFR may fall under fair use, keep in mind that companies can and will pull a copyright claim on you even if you are using their work fairly. Look at all the youtube videos that are technically fair use but are taken down for copyright reasons. And if they do take legal action, either you have to hire a good lawyer and plead your case in court - and hope the judge agrees with you, because otherwise you will have to pay a LOT of money - or come to a smaller, but still significant, settlement. Basically my point is that, just because the law is on your side, doesn't mean what you're doing is a good idea.

tl;dr let's keep getting proper permissions

In regards to YouTube, all that will happen is your youtube video will be removed or disabled within certain regions / countries. Now if this was 2006-8, a C&D letter would be sent to the individual.
(I have experienced both instances, in 2007 and 2012 - and my how things are better now then they were back then)

And while your statement is somewhat true, since remember there is no profit being gained what so ever in any way, shape, or form, I can guarentee that all they will do in a worst case senario is send a C&D letter. If FFR dosen't comply after 2(ish) requests, then legal action would be expected.

So I guess after thinking this over, I see something like this happening:


- If a lack of response has been given after 3 requests (with at-least 2 different meathods of contact), the user must attach their emails within the submission folder showing documentation proof of an attempt to contact.
- At any time the users file can be removed from FFR at any time without warning.
- (Perhaps these files should never be tokens either, in-case they do get removed)

Keep in mind we have been talking about worse case scenario.


On another note, since we credit each artists with homepage links and little facts about them when songs are released (assuming the homepage keeps getting updated like before) we can be considered musical bloggers, which is another area we can fall into in regards to copyright law.